Online Leftists
Memeing on online leftists.
Online Leftists
Episode 007: Progressive Victory & Democrap Sheepdogging
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Globe and Capy discuss the growing controversy surrounding Democratic Party–funded creators and the issue of fake progressives, dark money, and political influence in online left-leaning spaces. The episode focuses on PACs like Progressive Victory and their “Choose Your Fighter” rally, the way political organizations manipulate narratives, and how people who present themselves as progressive or socialist end up shilling for liberalism.
The conversation also explores the ideas of “Democratic orbiters,” electoralism, and how political streamers can be rewarded or ostracized depending on whether they support the Democratic Party.
In this episode we cover:
- Progressive Victory, PAC funding, and allegations that political organizations are using dark money and private payments to influence streamers and online political creators.
- Progressive Victory's “Choose Your Fighter" Rally featuring popular streamers such as Hasan Piker, Vaush, MikeFromPA, Dylan Burns, and other creators who position themselves as progressive or left-leaning.
- The trend of pro-Israel, pro-Ukraine, pro-Imperialist, and anti-trans views among many of the members of progressive Victory.
- Madeline Pendleton exposing Democratic Party–funded creators and the broader issue of fake progressives who present themselves as left-wing while promoting pro-establishment politics.
- How Bernie Sanders is a prime example of a “sheepdog” who uses radical-sounding language to funnel people back into the Democratic Party, and how the bourgeoisie repurposes vague anti-capitalist talking points to reinforce liberalism through TV, movies, and video games.
- The environment of the political debate sphere on streaming sites like Twitch.
- Ukraine and the bio-lab/bio weapon debate, and how bioweapons were used on the DPRK.
- The mystery of why influencers who make political content, whether for the Democratic Party, Israel, etc, always seem to get paid $7,000.
- How "progressive" politicians have redefined socialism and "leftism" in a way that confines it within liberalism.
- Capy learning about how the annoying "progressive" democrat glazer imreallyimportant (The 'Pretty fly for a white guy' dude) became a political streamer.
- The Great March of Return in Palestine and how destiny justifies the killing of unarmed Palestinians.
- Marxist-Leninist positions on the war between NATO and Russia and how so-called “Marxists” refuse to engage in any discussion or analysis of the pro-Russia position, instead waving it off as an “ACP position,” as well as the rejection of geopolitics by Western communists.
- A review of various tweets that are responding to Progressive Victory's “Choose Your Fighter" Rally.
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New patrons? Valkyr, that's it. Everybody go to patreon.com slash online leftists. Now, Cappy, we were on there last night and we had a very engaging stream uh regarding the break the blockade Nuestra Americana convoy or whatever, the Code Pink convoy to Cuba for the aid flotilla. Yeah. Yeah, it was fun. Did you have a good time? Yeah, it was very fun. And we have also, for everybody, if you're listening to this now, uh, that VOD is available for everybody. We decided like once a month to open it up and leave one of our Patreon exclusive live streams open to the public. Yeah. So once a month, it's not Patreon exclusive, it's everybody exclusive. Or not Patron exclusive at least. Yeah. You will still have to, if you want to interact with us during the live stream, you're gonna have to sign up for a free Patreon account and then follow us as a free member, uh, which is always an opportunity. And you want to go ahead and do that so you can interact with us during these very fun, very engaging live events uh that we do. But during that conversation, Cappy, we we ended up focusing on again Hassan. Yeah. Right? Yep. Uh there's so much context that podcast only people miss out on, huh? All of the little meta conversations that we have about stuff, they're really sort of getting an incomplete picture, huh? If they're not going to and uh watching our very much more extensive live streams.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, and they're they're also not getting down on any of the inside jokes. We have so many inside jokes now that you like I feel bad for people missing out.
SPEAKER_01Dewey, what are some examples of our inside jokes? I'm gonna cut that out. What? I don't know. What the fuck are you talking about? Bullying the hell out of me on those lives. Oh come on now. Yeah, we definitely this is definitely not gonna make it in there. I'm not, I don't bully. What are you talking about?
SPEAKER_02I see some. I abused my cat, but you don't bully me.
SPEAKER_01How when when have I ever fucking bullied you, you liar? You you little sleight of hand fucking emo scene kid, as bad as it was close-up magic pickup artist.
SPEAKER_02As bad as it was for your keyboard. I thought the spell and coke thing was funny. The suh, you know, that that whole thing was funny. If people weren't subscribed, they miss that. They missed the whole bit.
SPEAKER_01That is true, yeah. We do be doing uh we do be doing bits on there. Uh, but in there where I was abusing uh Cappy because he's a beta boy, um in that we were talking about the large criticiz the sort of um expansive criticisms we have about figures like Hassan Piker, who's sort of a nebulous dem orbiter. Now, I don't know specifically his positions modernly about uh third party, and I do think I do recall offhand him being criticized for advocating for thir voting for third party. However, I barely think he does, and all of his talk content, uh content and talking points seems to revolve around rehabilitating and or whitewashing uh uh damn candidates and platforming AOC and Bernie, and he seems to whenever they offer him a crumb of clout, he's there with his collar on.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, no, absolutely. And um anytime he says something like even a little bit radical, you know, his fans freak out and he reels it back in.
SPEAKER_01So yeah, he definitely has. There is um so there that is a valid thing. It's are you familiar with the concept of audience capture? Uh no, I I guess I'm not. It's one of the reasons why I don't do uh Twitch poll uh debate circle stuff anymore. People are like, they'll see me with like, uh, it'll be like an off dail. I would only have like 80 viewers. They're like, why don't you just like so-and-so's doing a debate? I'm like, I don't like those. They're like, but you get viewers. I'm like, and you have to sort of hold chat's hand, be like, I don't like a lot of those viewers. Like, think about what you're saying. It's like, well, you could have 400 rabidly uh pro-Israel transphobes in your chat right now. No, no, thanks. Uh yeah, that would be great for the community, right? Yeah, yeah. Why would I want them? They're like, but number bigger, but you have more stream, you will have more eyeballs on you. I'm like, Towards what purpose? They literally don't get it. Even chat is so like, you're winning, you have more viewers now. I'm like, but they're the wrong viewers. Yeah. They those viewers make me want to kill myself. Like, what like what do you like? What do you mean? When you do that debate sphere, um uh what's called blood sport, very contentious, um, very provocative debate spaces, you get the most edgelord people in your chat. Oh, yeah. Yeah. It's the worst audience.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, no, I know. I and and uh but liberal grifters don't care. They're making money, so it's all good.
SPEAKER_01They don't care. They like it. Yeah, they like they like fake controversy. So we say all that to say this. Uh, I open up Twitter today and I see that Hassan is uh the topic of more conversation because of this progressive victory choose your fighters rally, which is happening this weekend, uh, March 28th, 2026. They're going to be somewhere. They have assembled a cacophony of the most stinky, stinky dem-orbiting centrist shills. Vosh, Hassan Piker, Graham Platner, Nina Turner, Emma Wigland, I guess, from Majority Report. Crystal Ball, I guess Kyle Kalinski is involved, and uh Mike from PA, the person that um Bad Empinada was recently criticizing. I believe it's Hakeem. Okay, yeah, or no, Ugopnik. Uh Ugopnik and uh this Mike from PA character who you don't know any of these people, huh? Like Mike from PA.
SPEAKER_02I I I do not. I know I know Vosh, right? And I know Hassan. Um and and I think that's the extent of who I know. Do you know Central Committee, that name? The streamer?
SPEAKER_01Okay, that's also.
SPEAKER_02I stay away from streamers.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, so I was I was deeply embroiled in this as a Twitch poll person. I was definitely embroiled. I like I know all of these people, so we also have uh these are Progressive Victory associated people. Brianna Wu, are you familiar with them? The uh Gamergate person. No, no.
SPEAKER_02I I familiarized myself very briefly before this, but uh no, no, outside of that, no. So this will be a learning, a learning episode for me.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, some of the Progressive Victory, which is a pack nominally or ostensibly set up to fund progressives towards 2022 midterm election mobilization, they got into uh sort of a scandal and they became sort of a catch-all term for co-opted and um what's the other word um that I couldn't think of the other day versus uh Alex Jones? Oh, compromised. Uh yes, co-opted and compromised streamers. Um whenever you saw someone sort of shilling or maybe being a little bit disingenuous, they're like, oh, a progressive victory person. So this became the progressive victory in and of itself sort of worked as like a meta-conspiracy. As soon as anybody was saying something you didn't like, you're like, oh, progressive victory uh uh associated talking point, sort of like in the same way now where people would say, Oh, Israel, though, uh here's your seven thousand dollars type type thing, which is ironic because apparently seven thousand dollars is exactly the amount of money that they were paying people. Wow, all right, yeah. I didn't actually because they have uh Progressive Victory doesn't want to discuss the group that funded them. Yes, shady.
SPEAKER_02I wonder I wonder who it could be.
SPEAKER_01Yeah. Yeah. So uh you uh pre uh pre-launching this podcast, you had brought up that it's very interesting that Madeline Pendleton, another figure associated with that live stream that we did, uh the Code Pink uh um break the blockade uh aid flotilla, flotilla. Uh Madeline Pendleton was also associated with this type of thing when she went viral during the 2024 election online, where she was much reviled, people were stitching her. Uh the liberals people were stitching them, talking about the tankies, the problem with this, grifters, calling them a grifter, because of uh the fact that she had pointed out that she had been approached but through an agency or someone that uh manages some of her stuff, uh manages some of their stuff and brings it, uh brings opportunities to them. Madeline had pointed out that things that they had denied, as far as make a post saying this or this or this or this or this that was from Democrat associated packs and stuff like that, they had noticed that other creators in the left, lib, center, left space were doing those things and not disclosing them.
SPEAKER_02Yeah. Yeah, no, it's it's act it shaded me out so bad that now every time I see a sort of Bernie bro or like um you know compatible leftist, like uh trying to get people to vote for the uh lesser evil and stuff like that. I'm like, are you you're one of them, aren't you? You're getting paid by the Democrats to do this.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, but it's also it's it's sort of harder to diagnose than that because not unlike how we diagnose leftcom ism, uh the the whole sort of left comm framing of things as very kind of young, idealistic, and naive, somebody for whom the gritty externalities of geopolitics has not set in. Like their frontal f their frontal lobe is not fully formed, they don't know the way the world works yet, and they look at like ML projects, uh actually existing socialist projects as like totalitarian, authoritarian, having corrupted the core principles of Marxism or whatever, and not seeing that they're doing exactly what it takes to exist enough to become a viable socialist country. Yeah, yeah, absolutely. Uh, I think that the much in that same way, people who are young, naive, and idealistic still kind of inadvertently believe the canards of uh progressive democrat narratives where they think that America can be steered in a certain direction policy-wise.
SPEAKER_02Which it is fair because um, you know, in 2016 when uh Bernie was running, I um I thought that sounded good, you know, and I I was just at that time getting into Marxism, and um I I I um I that's who I wanted to be president, and and it wasn't until uh actually during that process is when I started to learn about uh Bernie's voting record and and was like, oh god. Uh but um yeah, I I was almost swept up into that, you know what I mean.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, Bernie Dog. So we're gonna be talking a lot today about sheepdogging, and it's very funny that Bernie Sanders is like the exemplar, the sort of uh example of record for being a sheepdog. Yeah. Uh somebody who uh basically uses extremist or not extreme fringe or far left or radical talking points that amount uh that amount into a wet fart. They turn into nothing, and they are only in service of safely mobilizing people to vote for Democrats yet again. Like I now think that I'm not even sure that Bernie Sanders ever intended to win. No, I that's that's what I I don't think so either. Like no, he had very many opportunities to say things that would have just absolutely cut people's heads off in uh in debates, and as a matter of course, and seemingly I I I can't even uh as a matter of course, he seemed to never go for blood with all of these people who were just def slandering him to his face. He's like, Well, you're a you're a fucking neoliberal. Like, what do you mean? You're anti-healthcare, you're anti this, you have this back, you're completely compromised. All of these things that which would have just made the the the crowd cheer, he never he pulled every single punch. Yeah, he was like literally like a fake, a fake opponent.
SPEAKER_02I just made a TikTok about this the other day because to an extent the bourgeoisie loves um vague anti-capitalism because they can they can absorb those criticisms and then like almost pacify you with them. I mean, or a better example would be uh Che Guevara t-shirts. This is something that comes up a lot, right? Uh the like the it's the vague anti-capitalism is not a threat, and they can use it to wow you, and you think that they're radical, and then they can redirect you back into the Democratic Party. You know what I mean? Yeah, this is uh what's his name? Uh Mark Fisher. Um the capitalist realism. Yeah, Mark Fisher talks about it. There's actually this really interesting quote from the video game Disco Elysium, and uh it's from a character named Joyce, who is like a uh an ultra-liberal, and she says, capital has the ability to subsume all critiques into itself, even those who would critique capital end up reinforcing it instead.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, that's basically the capitalist realism in a nutshell. And I do think that that is true. Another example uh of that, the Che Guevara t-shirt is uh Comrade Ash's uh recent uh uh clash with Green Ansen that we covered regarding the uh anarchist t-shirts at uh anarchist t-shirts at uh Walmart versus Hammer and Sickle. Yes, people will make money. It's sort of an asinine argument. Yes, there is a demand for t-shirts that people want to wear, so people buy them. Like I don't even know what we're talking about, but I think the largest thing, a larger thing is that uh buying a uh a radicalized t-shirt does not hurt Walmart. In fact, though, the the status quo beneficiaries tend to benefit from status quo stuff like getting t-shirts that you like. Yeah, right. Uh, but uh largely uh with um Mark Fisher's uh book uh Capitalist Realism, it's the idea that uh the system will subsume and not and it further even financialize things that are were earnestly genuinely threats to them. Like uh an example that he uses in the book, if I'm recalling correctly, I've read it many, very many years ago at this point, but he was talking about like the fact that in the 80s and 90s, most of if a bank was portrayed in a TV show, it was negative. A TV or a movie, the banks were the bad guys, they were the person coming to steal your farm. Like in the movie Blank Check, it's literally like an insurance adjuster or like a bank adjuster showing up. Like we understand the evil corporation. Yeah, like we get that, and then evil corporations buy scripts that have evil corporations in them and they push them out. These these counter status quo narratives are not actually injurious to the status quo unless you follow through and do something about them.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, no, absolutely. I mean, we see it all throughout capitalist culture. When the video games are like that. Like every fucking video game these days is the enemy is the evil corporation, right? But uh, but it's it's like it it's not, you know, I I don't even know how to put it. It it's so vague that it it poses no threat to the system. It doesn't even make the lights go off in people's heads, the light bulbs, you know. It's a vampire with no fangs.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, yeah. Uh there and I think that the the reason why Bernie Sanders is like the um uh example par excellence for this, um the um the exemplar sheepdog is the fact that like he pulled his punches, he sort of was like had a born loser mentality, played nice with these people, was sycophantic, j like Joe Biden would talk shit to him, and then Biden would say, Well, I don't want to return, I don't want to say anything bad about my friend Joe. He hates you! What do you mean? Like, they're like, say it! Say the mean thing, dog, and above and beyond that, like seemingly just being a controlled op uh uh to diffuse as a blow-off valve for you know further than uh status quo left talking points. He then rolled in, like, I still get DCC emails to this day because I donated some money to Bernie and he just gave that list completely over to the Democrats. Yeah. It's like, brother, what what like what is this?
SPEAKER_02Oh, he was a tool. His job was to corral people back to the Democratic Party. That's it.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, he's part of that wave of completely impotent activists that completely got subsumed by the system. Yeah. Absorbed, um, pacified, uh, their rough edges worn down, their ability to tear at the fabric of imperialism, colonialism, and capitalism completely nerfed.
SPEAKER_02I think they're conscious of it too. I don't think this is like, you know, like I think Bernie Sanders 100% understands what he is in the system and what he's used for. You know what I mean? Like they're they're like, let's face it, the bourgeoisie is out to protect the capitalist system.
SPEAKER_01Yeah. So we have a lot of talking points here that we wanted to get into. So we were talking about uh Madeline Pendleton exposing uh damn funded creators, uh reviled, right? Just speaking the truth, and like it's so weird that people were misconstruing what they were saying, people were uh uh putting words in their mouth. I'm doing I'm trying, if I slip up on their pronouns every once in a while, please uh forgive me. I'm trying to I'll probably try to edit them out, but I'm trying to they them them. Um uh but um so vis-a-vis the uh progressive uh victory rally, this is a so so you don't know very much about progressive victory, huh? No. So they've never heard of it. So this was basically a uh 2022 started hybrid pack uh that was basically um nominally uh or at face value uh trying to mobilize progressive streamers, quote unquote, into saying pro-democratic talking points on their streams. But the issue is it was done in a very clandestine fashion, right? Okay, yeah so it it br it breeded a lot of distrust with audiences and streamers who were seemingly saying status quo co-opted talking points without disclosing the fact that they were literally getting paid by a pack to promote Democrats, very similar to the Battle and Pendleton situation. Yeah, yeah. It's it's basically that. Um and but the the sort of vitriol from normies, it's much harder because I will say at the very least, Twitch poll and these streamers were constantly having to quell chat dissent regarding their their streamer fave being co-opted and shilling, right? Because the in the Twitch poll space, it is meant to be people speaking candidly about politics in a way that you don't get on mainstream media. Yeah, I get you, yeah. These sort of fringe alternative media figures then becoming sort of um proxies for mainstream media and mainstream talking points was troubling. But I will say that on TikTok, the flavor and tenor of these attacks against Madeline were a little bit different because normies are not politically savvy and normies are more utilitarian, and they they are sort of ensconced in this duopolistic uh mind frame where anything other than voting for my candidate means you're a Nazi and love Trump and blah blah blah.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, it was that was it was crazy. I mean, they they they were tearing Madeline apart for like I've it was like fucking months. It still goes on. Yeah.
SPEAKER_01Oh, I still see people calling uh Madeline a racist and a this and a that and yeah, because it's there is a it's they are dishonorifics that you can just sort of employ black and white thinking for you know that thing that uh Madeline Pendleton irritates people who are status quo normies. Yeah. Because they're right, more smarter, more correct, etc. etc. etc. Have more context for why context for why they believe what they believe and why why their positions are what they are. And that is very irritating to safe democratic voters who then aren't don't have the political savvy and or intelligence to sort of rebut any of those claims, so they sort of do that thing where they heighten the contrast, uh frame it as black and white, and then sort of slander, mislabel, or mischaracterize someone as being a a reviled figure. When it would be kind of simpler just to kind of educate themselves on the topic and then end up agreeing with Madeline.
SPEAKER_02Yeah.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, what you can't get these people to educate themselves. So I don't really know a lot about this Progressive Victory Choose Your Fighters Rally. I can't really find anything about that. It is vaguely anti-war. Yeah, so yeah, so they say. So I'm clicking on this here. It says this Saturday, 6 p.m. E.T., join Crystal Ball, Emmy V Emma Viglin, Oliver Larkin, Hartzel Gray, and Progressive Victory as we host a massive anti-war livestream fundraiser for candidates across the left. Uh oh, okay. So it's just a it's just a left fundraiser. Uh everyone is here. Ryan Grimm from uh like Breaking Points and the Intercept. Uh Joanne Reed is here. Are you familiar with them? No, no, I'm not. I believe that uh Joanne Reed, I think. Think that she was recently fired for something. Mike from PA, Dylan Burns. Uh, I'm going down this list here. Track APAC is there. Wait, what? Uh I'm going down the tweets here. Uh so if you look at this, I'm gonna send this to you in Discord here.
SPEAKER_02Oh, okay, cool.
SPEAKER_01If you scroll down here, in reply to Hassan the s uh Hassan the Hun, Vosh, Rokana, Ryan Grimm, Nina Turner, uh Graham Plattner, Benjamin P. Dixon. I don't know who that is. I don't know who a lot of these people are. Mike from PA and Dylan Burns is wild. Yeah, I feel like I know Dylan Burns. Yeah, you should. Dylan Burns was the host of the Hippy Dippy round table. Um, you probably saw Vosh and Destiny and Hawes on there. I was I've been I was on there five times. I used to I was very much like a political debate guy. I I won it all five times. I bet that's good. You're doing good for our side. Um yeah, but the problem is you do sort of subtly you do these sort of rhetorical tactics to appeal to liberals. You know what I mean? Because I'm trying to win a conversation. You know what I mean? So it's sort of like a gross feeling, and I definitely felt like I'm in enemy territory the whole time. Uh Crystal Ball, Emma Vigland, uh I'm scrolling through. Uh okay, so I don't quite know what this is. I I this was I thought supposed to be like an anti-war thing. But watching this reminded me of the uh similar to the Madeline Pendleton situation, the co-opting of people uh by progressive victory in the Twitch poll space, and uh these sort of fake progressive center left democrat orbiting status quo compatible people. Do you know so you don't know anything about uh Brianna Woo?
SPEAKER_02I was gonna say I haven't heard of half of these people until tonight. So if they're big streamers, I just I guess I I don't spend enough time in streaming communities.
SPEAKER_01Uh this is uh from an AI overview about Brianna Woo, uh Gamergate and online harassment, target of Gamergate on October 2014. Wu became a major target of the Gamergate movement after posting jokes on Twitter mocking the group. Uh da da da da da. She uh uh she basically felt a lot of the harassment results on the PTSD diagnosis for Wu. Uh political uh let's see here, scroll down to here. Shift in political stances and criticism to 2023 present. Pro-Israel stances following the October 7th, 2023 attack, Wu became an outspoken supporter of Israel, stating that casual anti-Semitism as a progressive spaces has become impossible to ignore. She's also sort of a conservative in that she's uh promoting transmedicalism, uh, the view that being transgender requires medical transition, and expressed concern that quote unquote radical trans activism is harming the trans community's public perception. So basically, you are not status quo enough, you are not de uh supporting Democrats enough. Stop with the weird stuff, guys. Why can't you just be a transmedicalist like me?
SPEAKER_02That's wild. In fact, I this should destroy Hassan's credibility amongst some Marxists who still like him, that he's even a part of this with people like that. That's insane. Uh the uh what what was her name that you just mentioned? The uh Brianna Wu? Brianna Wu, yeah. Like uh what you know.
SPEAKER_01I don't know. So Brianna Wu has stepped back from her association with Progressive Victory, but I think that she was like an administrator or a high up there consultant. Uh it was basically like a one-to-one reference. Like, as far as I was concerned, around 2022-2023, Brianna Wu was Progressive Victory. She like ran it, as far as I could tell. I get you, yeah. So uh yeah, they had the Gamergate stuff, the transmedicalism, and rabid Zionists, and they still say like you could just go on Twitter and look up Brianna Wu, Arab, Islam, anything else like that. They're rabidly anti-Palestinian. It's a really disgusting person. Just really, really an apartheid chill. It's very, very gross. It's bizarre. Any of these progressives being pro-Israel is just the most bizarre thing because it's like literally being, oh yeah, I'm a center-left progressive, and also I like chattel human slavery. It's literally a non-starter position being pro-Israel. The amount of geopolitical naivete that you have to have, not only geopolitical, just political naivete, that you have to have to think a settler colonial ethnostate is acceptable, and that you should say use a lesser evil uh uh uh analogy because uh the only way to make Israel palatable is to lie about its neighbors.
SPEAKER_02Yeah. Yeah, but yeah, which is exactly what they do. That's why you Americans think the whole fucking the whole of West Asia is just uh, you know, terrorist countries and then poor Israel in the middle of all of these mean terrorist countries. They're the only dem they're the only democracy in the area, Cappy. Oh yeah.
SPEAKER_01Oh, I've heard. Yeah, I I have heard. Um don't you know what they do to gay people in insert country? Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah, they they get bombed. That's what they did. That's what they don't you know what the happens to uh gay people in Iran. I don't know, they get bombed. Don't you know what happens to gay people in Palestine? They throw you off a Hamas would throw you off a fucking building. Well, good luck. They bombed all the buildings. Yeah. What do you mean? Which building, dog?
unknownYeah.
SPEAKER_01Good luck. They would have their they would have their work cut out for them trying to find a building to throw a gay person off of. Like, what do you mean? You know how many dead bodies of gay people you would have to step over to find uh a living gay person that you could throw off a building that exists if you were Hamas? Real real fucking uh real uh tough road to hoe there.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, that it's uh that's what I was gonna say. You know how we save the uh gay people in uh Palestine by bombing the fucking shit out of them.
SPEAKER_01So you don't know any of these fucking people? Brianowu, Hassan, Destiny. I'm really important to be. I know Destiny.
SPEAKER_02I know Destiny, of course.
SPEAKER_01Destiny was part of the De jure like progressive victory crew, along with the bigger the bigger names here that you should focus on are Dylan Burns. Dylan Burns ran the the hippie dippy pot, uh, the hippie dippy hippie dippy round table, which was sort of like a weekly uh contentious political conversation that was sort of was framed as sort of like a wrestling event where colorful political figures came in and sort of vied for a big raid. So if you won, if you won the hippie dippy round table, you would get a raid, and there would be like 800 people watching. So uh so my personal experience, I would go in there, I would get invited, Dylan Burns Booker would reach out to me. Um shout out to fucking what's his name? Fuck. Anyway, he was always very nice to me. Uh Dylan Burns Booker would reach out, book me on the show, uh, try to make an interesting panel. He would always like pick figures that I could like pick apart and make, you know, make a meal out of. He was very nice uh in that way. So he would kind of set set me up for victory, as it were, uh, and then um uh book me, do the show, and then after the like an hour or two of talking, they sort of uh Dylan would raid into like uh who's the sort of unofficial winner. So and then like eight, seven, eight, uh, uh seven, eight hundred thousand people might be watching your stream all of a sudden. So it was a nice little um uh community-building thing. However, a lot of the uh Dylan Burns in particular, you're not aware of him whatsoever. He's the guy who went to Ukraine, he raised a lot of money to go to Ukraine to do uh atrocity propaganda.
SPEAKER_02I think I the I know him from something back in like 2016, 20, or not even that, that I probably like 2019. And I think I think it was from I think it was Haas. I think didn't Haas debated him.
SPEAKER_01No, uh yes, no, Haas and yes, no, you you were probably thinking of the debate, the China v. Taiwan debate that Haas and Dylan Burns had, and they were also teasing like a boxing event or something. Oh yeah, yeah, I do remember that. Holy shit. Yeah, that's a throwback, yeah.
SPEAKER_02I I yeah, okay, so I do know who I I do know who this guy is then. Yeah.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, and so uh then he did the hippy-dippy round table where Vosh and Destiny and other people uh were on there, including myself. Uh and then he sort of raised uh like $20,000, $30,000, I forget, from a GoFundMe, and then at the advent of the very justified uh uh Russian quote unquote invasion of Ukraine, the non-military action or whatever it is, special the special military action that is very justified, by the way, uh uh into uh quote unquote uh Ukrainian quote unquote uh sovereign land, quote unquote quote unquote unquote unquote. Um uh he decided to uh go there and talk to a lot of non-Azov people. It seems like he was kind of selective in who he didn't talk to.
SPEAKER_03Yes.
SPEAKER_01Uh so uh so that is how he kind of split his community. I don't know what they do now. I sort of lost track after they became like an out and out Ukraine show, but I could tell you, Keppy, that I was persona non grata. Uh I was called every name in the book, uh Russian shill, a Russian bot, tanky, this, that, the other thing, for just saying like it's Russia's sphere of influence.
SPEAKER_02Yeah. Well, nowadays you can't even talk badly about even if you're not talking about Russia, you say something negative about NATO and people are like Putinist, Putin Shill, and it's like what we're talking about like North Korea, bro. What are you what are you on about?
SPEAKER_01Yeah, no, I think it's it was definitely worse than. That was this was before October 7th. This was this was uh the the uh Ukraine was the only thing going on, right? The the psychopolitics of Putin, the derangement, the uh the uh that was this was the standing issue, and it was the issue by that got Haas and uh uh Jackson Hinkle kicked off of Twitch, along with myself, basically. I became Persona non grata because of my takes on Ukraine and other things, but I think specifically Haas and Hinkle were kicked off for biolabs conspiracies. Oh, all right, yeah. Talking about the Ukrainian manufacturing of Russian genetic specific uh uh pathogens which would uh attack, which would only attack Russian people, which doesn't really make sense because they're the same people. Sometimes those two are are just insane. Well, it it does it does seem like there was okay, and to push back on that a little bit, there was a lot of uh Soviet-era um biolabs there. Yeah. There was, it was a heavily industrialized area. Uh those facilities need special accommodations. There were districts that make sense for them to go, along with like energy and uh state secret stuff. There was sort of like in the Soviet system, there was like districts to place that stuff, right? Where you could like largely monitor foot traffic into it, and it was much more secure. Sure, yeah. So it was in those kind of facilities. Uh, and there was a concern at the time where uh Putin was doing strikes on buildings associated with uh bio um uh biological research. This was also during pandemic. So everybody was very pandemic and anti-medical misinformation brained. So very quickly, the idea that Putin was going to bomb biolab stuff became fraught, it became a sort of it became fraught for contentious and very black and white thinking regarding pandemic protocols, man-made pathogens, yeah, and conspiracism around both those things because there was a larger prevailing narrative about COVID being man-made at the time. And so this feathered in with sort of the idea, and previous to this, there was idea that of sort of like using gain of function to target things or to have pathogens target certain populations.
SPEAKER_02Okay, I see.
SPEAKER_01Uh those things all combined into this idea that their Ukraine had sort of NATO or Western World Health Organization funded biolabs through which they they had like legacy pathogens that were designed to be a bioweapon against Russian people.
SPEAKER_02Okay, yeah, I I I mean it it's honestly doesn't even sound that far-fetched, let's be honest.
SPEAKER_01Well, how do you how do you diff differentiate genetically from a Ukrainian and a Russian?
SPEAKER_02Well, no, you yeah, no, not that part, but the by the just bioweapons in a general sense.
SPEAKER_01It is the standard prevailing opinion now that many of the claims made against the United States government um regarding bioweapons in Korea and the admissions of those POWs are like now considered true.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, oh that's exactly what I mean. Yeah. I mean that they might have been off on some wild shit about it, but the uh the the I guess the the core idea of bioweapons being used is very believable.
SPEAKER_01Valkyr in the Discord goes further and says that they are actually it's even more pernicious because there's there is talk that the pathogens themselves were made out of the viscera of human beings. Really?
SPEAKER_02Oh I'll have to talk to Valkyrie about that. That's very interesting.
SPEAKER_01Well, uh, if you ask her about it, she will post 37 paragraphs in Spanish.
SPEAKER_02It's like great. Well, good thing that we're in the age of uh just holding the middle button on your phone and translating everything. On what? What do you mean? What middle button on your phone? Do you are you an Apple user? What do you mean? No, no, not button. It's not an actual button, it's just that thing on your screen, that little circle. I have a galaxy. I'm a Republic of Samsung fan. What? I have no idea what you're talking about. The little middle circle.
unknownWhat the fuck are you doing?
SPEAKER_02I'll take uh uh I'll I I will take a screenshot of my phone and send it to you later.
SPEAKER_01I literally never heard about this. Okay, but let's get back on track. So some of these people, so we know Hassan, we know Brianna Wu, we know Destiny. Destiny and all of these people, except for Vosh, are like rapidly. I associated, I began to associate progressive victory. Here's where my personal beef with them comes in. I don't give a shit about dem. I knew what these people were from the beginning. Uh when I'm like, everyone's like, you just call everyone a liberal. I'm like, because you guys are liberals, you guys are fucking liberals, you guys are fake progressives, democrat orbiters. They're like, you just cut and paste that same thing about everyone. I'm like, it is the best qualifier for you people. Yeah, you guys are sheepdogs, democrat orbiters, doing wedge issue talking point stuff. Like, I was persona non grata there for a year, but my contention with these people was how many people associated with progress uh progressive victory money. Let's talk about that for a little bit. They're anti-Palestinian, pro-Israeli stats, specifically Destiny, who now seems to have distanced themselves from Progressive Victory a little bit. They just there's a tweet here we can show where they're kind of talking shit about him a little bit. Uh-huh. In something like uh late 2023, uh, Twitch put in new terms of service that made people who are recipients of politics and uh uh political money and other things have to disclose it. They sort of forbade and they made it a terms of service violating thing to be getting money and uh for uh paid opinions, basically, which is good. Yeah. Um, I guess. Uh you know, I'm permaband on Twitch, whatever, so fuck Twitch. However, uh they made it so it was like TOS violation to uh be paid for political opinions and to not disclose it, and or to be paid at all, da da da. Uh, and I think that was largely because of fears of Russian influence, Russian bots. Yeah, that they don't care about the Democrats and the Republicans paying people. It's funny how these progressives got nailed, these uh vehemently anti-Russia people, uh, and the hysteria that they whipped up about Russian bots inadvertently caused Twitch TOS to then put in exemptions which technically qualified for these people who were uh previously safe recipients of Democrat money.
SPEAKER_02Yeah. Yeah, well, I mean, just like everything else, right? If um if if if if America does it, it's good. If Russia does it, it's bad.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, including um riding shirtless on horseback. Um so in so to to curtail this new thing, what Progressive Victory started doing apparently was having weekly cons um weekly meetings with quote unquote consultants. So these streamers were then designated as consultants to the organization, and they were had weekly sealed and closed door meetings uh protected by a non-disclosure agreement where they were the recipient of five hundred to seven thousand dollars a month. Now that seven thousand dollar a month figure sticks out, yeah, right? Yeah, it is that the Madeline Pendleton thing about getting seven thousand dollars. There was there was also the Taylor Lorenz thing, uh, who also uh discussed how people were getting uh influencers on TikTok were also receiving up to seven thousand dollars to make pro-democrat uh talking points.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, that I I I'm not sure if that's the number, but if it was, that's so weird. I mean, it could just be a coincidence, but I don't know if there's more to it than that, but maybe it has to do with tax structures under PACs.
SPEAKER_01Oh, that's true. I didn't think about that. You can pay $7,000 a month up to, you know, for a certain type of protected designated uh employee or something. I don't know. Yeah.
SPEAKER_02I admittedly have very little knowledge of PACs in in in general, so yeah.
SPEAKER_01Uh so they circumvented Twitch to S that prevents political funding of streamers by paying them for weekly closed-door meetings, $500 to $7,000 a month. Uh dark money allegations followed, uh, leading people to wonder about co-opted talking points. So in the video that we linked uh here above, it sort of goes through. So you don't know, so I know all these people. Dylan Burns, Wick TV, and Prime K's. Wick TV is sort of a centrist, center left, very like, I don't even know how to describe these people. Normy, progressive person. Prime K's, uh, I used to I cut my teeth doing these, I would just join these panels. I would go on Prime K's, I would go on Wick TV, I would go on Dylan Burns, and just sort of have p contentious political conversations. So where these people are all meant to be candid truthsayers. Yeah. Right? They're not like, hey guys, vote Democrat. They might say, yeah, sure, I like the Democrats more than the Republicans, but all of these people sort of painted themselves as leftists, as progressives. What is the allure with progressivism and leftism that by default liberals seem to want to identify as that d while doing no research?
SPEAKER_02You're asking what the allure is to painting yourself as a progressive, right? When you have done no research into it, that was your question.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, basically. Yeah, no, it's like this. There was recently a a new person. Did you see this? It's like an Asian American person who popped on and everybody thought it was funny and cute because it's like, have you noticed that like politicians lie? It was a post like that. It was this person who popped on and said, like, why do so many liberals go on TikTok and s and use leftist talking points without disclosing that they're a liberal and a Democrat voter? Yeah.
SPEAKER_02Well, uh, so to answer, I I think right, the reason why politicians do it is because they are tricking you, right? They they understand that if they say that type of stuff, they'll get support of people, and like we were talking about earlier, they can redirect that back into the Democrats. Now, the only reason I would think that influencers on the internet or streamers would do that is because they're getting paid to do it. Some of them might not be, some of them might actually think that they're truly progressive. Um, but at this point I'm skeptical that anybody who has, you know, that calls themselves a dem soch or a soci or a progressive uh, you know, who is trying to get you to vote for the Democrats, I have a hard time believing that they're not being funded.
SPEAKER_01No, I think I I I will push back on that. I think that the successful ones, I think the ones that are sharp and have two to three hundred to two to three to four hundred to five hundred viewers, yes. Very m very many people are not very self-aware. And some people probably fall for it, yeah. They they are they think that they are progressive leftists because they associate leftism with being um pro-trans. Well, that's the thing. They associate they associate leftism with healthcare. They associate they associate democrats with sort of being like a corporate co-opted leftist political party.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, they've um they've sort of stripped leftism, quote unquote leftism of anything like economic or even political. It's just basically you know social safety nets and and um you know social progressivism.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, I I wouldn't say completely stripped because they do have like let's say healthcare. They largely make economical arguments for for that. Right? Capitalism bad. Right? But what they're what they mean is when they say capitalism bad, what they in effect mean is I want less influence from corporations, not to get rid of corporations.
SPEAKER_02That that's what I was it's it's it's like uh with Bernie, you're more likely to hear him talk about the oligarchs and the corporations. He never uses capitalism really, um like by name. It's always the oligarchs, the corporations, you know.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, and that's probably like talking point. They see like they have um consultants and other people like steering them in the right way. Like people love it when you you call out the oligarchs because it's a new thing. They people are less familiar with the term, it's punchier. Yeah. You know, they like it's a thing that is more progress uh uh because you don't want to remind people who are probably most centrists are pro-capitalism. They may not know it, but they are. And you could tell by just mentioning any communist country.
SPEAKER_02Oh, yeah. Well, hey, but when I was still uh like a practically a liberal, I thought I was anti-capitalist. I didn't realize that the ideas that I thought were anti-capitalist were actually within the liberal you know framework. I had no idea because I didn't know about Marxism. I didn't know about like how what socialism was, you know, so I thought, no, yeah, I'm I'm a leftist.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, you were at uh like anti-corporate corruption. Yeah anti like dark money in politics, stuff like that. Yeah, during the Occupy movement, that was very big. Yeah, no, 100%. Very like that sort of ad busters, Occupy, uh, Occupy Wall Street, sort of uh, and that was all sort of like a a national uh referendum that we had on the subprime mortgage implosion and CDOs and collateral dot uh debt obligations and like bailing out the the um um the automakers with like the TARP funds and things like that. Yeah. Okay, uh and all of these progressive victory people seem to be pro-Israel, which is uh very similar to the Madeline Pendleton ops, uh, where Madeline had showed, like, look, there's these talking points that these people are hitting that were exactly per the script that I denied, and they were gonna pay me like 5k to do this, meaning I'm inferring and I'm looking at these people regurgitating by rote this script. Also, I had somebody say in chat that I say uh rote incorrectly, but I think that they don't know the difference between route because route and rote. Yeah. I was like thinking about that after the fact, I'm like, what are you talking? I'm like, because they said you don't say route correctly. I'm like R-O-U-T-E. Like, what do you mean by and then I was like, what are they talking about? And like I didn't even say that. They're like, oh, by rote, they're listening to the podcast popping on here and saying you don't say route correctly. Why is chat so dumb? Hey, at least they're listening though.
SPEAKER_02Cappy, why are these why are these chatters just like that? I don't know. You hear that chat, you're useless, you're dumb. We can't rely on you for anything. And and you guys are just NPCs. They almost ruined two streams ago.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, literally true. Um, by influencing you to influence me to spill a coke, yeah. So we have Brianna Woo Destiny, uh, I'm really important. You have no idea who I'm really important is, do you? No, I'm sorry, Glow. I'm really important. I pretty you know the oh hold on. Do you know this? Hold on.
SPEAKER_02And all the girlies say I'm pretty fly for a white guy. Oh, uh the offspring. Yeah, yeah, of course I know that song.
SPEAKER_01He's the I'm pretty fly for a white guy guy.
SPEAKER_02Okay, yeah. Literally, you know him? No, well, I know him from that song, but no, I I've never watched him or listened to him speak or outside of that song. I have no idea.
SPEAKER_01He I've been getting him on my tw uh TikTok FYP lately. Okay. I pop in there. Did you know that uh he's about a 300 to 400 viewer, Andy, who's very progressive politics, he supports all of the Democrats. Okay, he's a very progressive Democrat guy. He he he's very like, mmm, you're actually wrong because this bill that that Ro Khanna is introducing does show that they do care about healthcare. He's like one of those guys, he's constantly sanitizing and glazing Democrats, he is a firm left wing of the fucking duopoly guy. The Democrats do no wrong. They're the only countervailing thing that we have to fascism. He sucks their cock every fucking day. It's what he does. He's literally a liberal Democrat glazer. And it's funny because he's literally the I'm um pretty fly for a white guy, white guy from the from the video. And he went on tour with the offspring. That's that is pretty funny. And now he's a political commentator, okay? That's so weird. His username is I'm really important, and I I used to be his alert when you get like a dono or a sub or something. I would say, like, uh, I don't know, I said something about like, oh, uh, I'm I'm really important as my favorite lib. I said something like that, and he clipped it and used it as his dono alert for forever. Which is funny because he also had lib blacklisted in his chat. It was a filtered word, so you couldn't because he was getting so many people coming in there and just slurring him by calling him a lib, he eventually just like blacklisted it. Which is very common across progressive Twitch poll streams. It's the most commonly flagged term.
SPEAKER_02Yeah. Is lib. It's interesting, actually. Like yeah, because yeah, they're hiding it.
SPEAKER_01They're hiding it, and or they're just tired of saying they're just tired of talking about it. The fact that they're liberals. Um, uh Lonerbox is another associated, uh, progressive victory person. Him and Destiny went to Israel after October 7th. Oh. Uh, they participated in very many debates. Uh uh Lonerbox is a person that me, I personally had a back and forth to uh with. Basically, uh they started off as a progressive, they they um drew the ire of a lot of trans people for like denying the trans genocide in America, uh saying that it didn't qualify, being pedantic and weird, which is weird because they have like a trans partner or did, I think they broke up over that. I'd fuck it up so uh they're very, very like um a person who focuses on the details of a specific claim to like eck out semantic victories while completely being obtuse about big picture stuff. I get you, yep. That is such a fucking liberal tactic. It is, it's uh it sucks so much, bro. Like actually, and they like they'll take a sentence and break it down into 37 points and then like have a study for each one. You're like, brother, uh like it's it's very, very sad. Like, so therefore, capitalism is not bad, you know, and and and none of these people would irritate me if they just said I'm a liberal. Yeah, yeah. Well if they just admitted it, yes, I am a democratic orbiter and a liberal, I'd be like, oh, okay, well, yeah, then these are commonsensical positions for you. But they have all those positions while vehemently denying that they're not leftists. Yeah, it's it's like bizarre. They all call themselves socialists, they all call them except for Destiny, he calls himself an omniliberal or whatever the fuck now. He's basically a conservative at this point.
SPEAKER_02I I think he he destiny might actually understand what socialism actually is better than the rest of them. I do think a lot of these people are probably genuinely confused because capitalism confuses people and the and and the bourgeoisie loves to confuse people. And all you have to do is get that snowball rolling, and then the people will keep it rolling. I don't think destiny understands what socialism is.
SPEAKER_01I think that he no, he's he I actually think that he's like what's going on with him is pathological. I think that I think that he is a sort of retributive, he has a a pile of of antagonisms that that under underlie any of his political positions. He will say anything at any time to attack anybody who criticized him. He doesn't actually know, and it's just laid bare. Like, for instance, my main thing with Destiny, where I was like kind of surveilling what because everybody copies what Destiny says in the Twitch poll space, low-key. They do. So I was monitoring what he was saying post-October 7th, and I was watching him prepare for a quote unquote debate with someone, and he went on to like the not the flower massacre. What is the that one event in Palestine where they shot everyone in the knee?
SPEAKER_02Um what when Israel did that? Are you talking about the massacre? Well, uh what pops into my mind is the uh what was it called, the Great March of Return in 2019, where they Yes, that.
SPEAKER_01Yes, yes, it was the Great March of Return. He was on there and he was like, Oh, this looks bad, guys. On stream, on the live, reading the Wikipedia page was his research for that. Uh he got to the section where it was talking about and IDF opened up and started kneecapping everybody, and he's like, This actually looks kind of bad. And then one of his chat, he scanned chat, and one of his chatters says, actually, some of the Palestinians rushed the gates of the thing. He's like, Oh, really? Okay, good, and clicked out of the whole article. That's all I needed to hear. What? And I just got this weird feeling in my stomach where this isn't these are not even real events to him, these are conversations to him, and these are he like okay, so he checked a box. Okay, I know what I need to say with that. Then I just need to call them violent and unhinged and uh not rational for marching people uh marching on people with guns, that's and then like backed out, and no further research required, backed out of the whole article. He's it's so like I don't even know have the words to describe what that is.
SPEAKER_02Opportunist sophistry, it's gotta be an ego thing, too. He has his positions and he wants to win in debates, and it makes him feel good, and he just got the answer. It's like the golden key. Oh, you mean you mean unarmed Palestinian terrorists rushed the gates? Of course, Israel was just defending themselves.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, tank blast kid in head. Okay. Damn, that looks bad. Oh, but did you see that the kid threw a rock at the tank first? Oh, perfect. Never mind. Got it. I'm prepared for this conversation. Now it's like, oh, brother, kill yourself.
SPEAKER_02But you can't, you there is nothing that can justify that. There's a great documentary about that uh that uh event uh by Empire Files. Abby Martin was literally there and they were filming the whole thing, and the footage is like you'll you'll like it makes you want to throw up when you're watching it. It legitimately makes you feel sick.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, no, uh I I I believe that is when I became like very uh I think that is the thing that made me very vehemently anti-Israel. That was like came out in the late 2010s.
SPEAKER_02Uh well 2019 um is when it happened and when that came out, but there are plenty of other things that you might have seen before that from other events that you know if you I feel like if you're a uh a normal functioning human being, then you would be like, oh, what the fuck?
SPEAKER_01Yeah, but yeah, so like I've been anti-Israel since uh like maybe 2010, like that was like vocally a position of mine, like nah, Israel's not good. Shouldn't like Israel, actually. Israel sucks. Um, okay, so I think that's basically uh all we got here. Do you want to look at some of the nah we don't need to c uh cover the tweets. So one of the issues with this progressive victory thing is like the corrosive effects of like dark money and packs, like from a theory perspective, can we look at this as anything other than just capitalism?
SPEAKER_02No, yeah. I mean, so right, some people will say, Oh, it's corruption, it's corruption, but it's like, no, it's not like the issue with capitalism is never that it's corrupt, it's it's the system is inherently, inherently uh exploitative and negative for working class people. Dark money has been a thing since before the internet. The that's right. People throw fucking money around, people lobby, you know what I mean, and and they don't want you to know where the money's that's nothing new, right? There's there's a long history of that within capitalism. So I don't think it's like um just like corruption or you know I don't even know how to put it. It I feel like that is just part of capitalism.
SPEAKER_01Part of my autistic brain really has a grievance against these people and money recipients for the sort of reflexive way I was ostracized for saying commonsensical, non-co-opted, non-contrived things where I was speaking expositionally and making arguments why it's okay to support Russia and that sphere of influence and everything else like that. And then people who were unbeknownst to me and other people were taking money from political action committees who were aligned with NATO and um uh controlling and setting about to control the narrative in what was supposed to be a candid political conversation place and and pedaling that secret influence to ostracize people like me, Hazaldine, and Jackson Hinkle, who you can there, there's many things that you can say about all three of us that are problematic. However, regarding Russia-Ukraine, objectively correct.
SPEAKER_02It's so annoying because now, whenever you try and talk about like Russia or Iran, and you have like what I what I view as like a normal Marxist-Leninist position, other you know, so-called Marxists won't even engage with you about that position. They'll just call you ACP, and then that's it. They they think that's the oh, that's an ACP talking point. It's like, no, you you fucking dickheads. This is a talking point from from uh North Korea. This is a talking point from Cuba. Like, this is just a communist talking point, like right, it's not it has nothing to do with them, but they won't even engage in the argument anymore.
SPEAKER_01So we were talking a little bit about people LARPing as progressives, people LARPing as less leftists, Justice Democrats 2.0, the squad. I don't think we nominally mentioned some of these talking points, these little bullet points that I have here. But uh I think that the problem is is that the compatible narratives are they have absorbed those by osmosis, anyways. These people are not sort of willfully um putting out these from a sort of very like introspective or like studied position. They are regurgitating the narratives that live within them already. Yeah. Right? And very much in the same way, these quote-unquote Marxist-Leninists or these Marxists, the people who identify as socialism, Marxist, whatever, who then find themselves butting up against MLs like you or me, they have that same reflexive internalized narrative coming out. And this is the problem with people like Green Anson who who are attributing it to malevolent uh intent and like literal paid co-option and um uh compromising that people are like willfully having these positions where I see it just sort of as a reflexive thing that they're saying because that is the prevailing worldview in their imperial core place regarding that. These Marxist-Leninists just don't know geopolitics. They just they just never looked into it.
SPEAKER_02I was I was just me and me and a comrade at work today were just complaining about this for like an hour. We were we were just talking about it for like an hour. It's it's so fucking frustrating. So one of the biggest things, right, is when we talk about the the uh what is a war between Russia and NATO, right? Um, it's very common that people go, you know, because uh people will go, well, real communists don't support Russia. And so I'll say something like, oh, they don't? Well, how come the Workers' Party of Korea does? Why does Cuba, how come other communist parties like China, they may not outwardly say, hey, we support Russia, but they'll blame NATO, right, for the uh so-called invasion of Ukraine. Um so all of these all of these communist parties have an anti-NATO view that's either um explicitly pro-Russia or uh at the very least functionally pro-Russia, and people will just go, oh well, you know, it's um it's just because it's geopolitics. They have to, and it's like, um, okay, so what do geopolitics not affect the communist movement here? Does it not affect you? Do you actually care about Koreans or Cubans? Because like that's it, it just doesn't make sense to me how you could uh sever uh geopolitics from uh the um American communist mov or any communist movement. It does it doesn't make sense, it's so fucking weird. Especially being an anti-imperialist. You know, I a lot of people have said that this is insane. Uh, I've said this before, but in the age of imperialism, uh, you know, anti-imperialism uh needs to come first before all of this fucking ideological purity and and um you know uh whatever, whatever. We need to be anti-imperialists, right? Um and sometimes being an anti-imperialist means that your your position is going like you're going to have things that align with other countries. This is why the campusm thing is so fucking goofy, and this is why, because because campusm is just fucking material reality. Sometimes countries have um their interests align, and so they would be fucking crazy to not work together. Like it we're in a global system of imperialism with a global imperialist hegemon that has 800 military bases around the world. What the fuck else are you going to do when you're when when something you want to do aligns with someone else? You you can't choose your fucking friends.
SPEAKER_01It's like being a progressive in Nazi Germany who puts healthcare above, you know, hey, what why don't we stop invading our neighbors? Yeah. Like you have to stop invading the you have to stop that the ultranationalism is more important. Yeah. That I'm sorry, yeah. I I understand it sucks. You should you deserve better health care. However, stop invading other countries. Yeah.
SPEAKER_02Like that is they don't care so long as the violence is exported, right? It's as long as it's not going on with them, if they can get free health care. What's it matter what we're doing to say Iran or uh or Palestine or North Korea? That doesn't matter because it they're getting health care.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, it's just out of sight, out of mind, it's an abstraction. It's an inconvenient conversation to have. Yeah, absolutely. What you're doing. That is preventing them from doing their reflexive entryism and uh reformism.
SPEAKER_02Yeah. And that honestly this connects to what we were just talking about because I feel like when people want to just uh reject uh a position because uh oh I don't, you know, which like yeah, I don't like the ACP either, but but like to reject the position because uh the ACP may have it, um, it's like an easy way out. You don't actually have to engage with the hard questions, you don't have to engage like with your position in the the imperialist system and how it benefits you, right? You can just go, oh no, uh you know, it it's wrong.
SPEAKER_01Half of these half of these TikTok Marxists would be pro-capitalism if they figured out the ACP's against it.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, well, yeah, which is so goofy. Uh, you know, I it's it's frustrating. It's so frustrating because I like again, I'm not uh I've like I'm a fucking Sakaiist. Like I I'm completely the opposite of them, but I've been called ACP multiple times now.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, and it's also just sort of a buzzword, you know, it's like it's buzzword politics from NPC people who don't read. It is okay. So let's wrap this up, sir. So we have this this whole progressive victory thing, the Madeline Pendleton, funded posts, all of these things, the Taylor Lorenz exposing uh Democrats paying people. This is all basically NATO support, status quo gatekeeping duopoly uh warriors. This is all standard fare, right?
SPEAKER_02Yeah, I mean, yeah, it's they're they're literally tricking the people here to keep them within the confines of liberalism.
SPEAKER_01Sheep this is a whole sheep sheepdogging operation. The I think it is w weaponizing leftist rhetoric towards pacifying people and making them likely Democrat voters.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, I I would say that's exactly what it is. And and it is anti-communist. It's that's that's its function. If you're if you're not pro-communist, you're anti-communist. 100%. There's no way around it. Yeah. Uh what the fuck is Hassan doing with these people? See, I don't know because Hassan has some credibility, not among me, I don't like Hassan, but among some Marxists, they give him the benefit of the doubt. I think that any benefit of the doubt people were giving Hassan should have gone out the window the moment that he started to uh work with a group like this. I mean, this is crazy. Multiple of these people are rabid Zionists, and it what are essentially um I would consider them American nationalists. Let's be honest. That's what they are.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, yeah. Since we're bringing up uh ACP, Eddie Liger Smith on Twitter uh uh quoted this tweet, uh this progressive victory thing announcing the rally here that says Vosh has supported almost every US-led regime change effort in history, only opposing those led by Republican presidents. He openly supports uh wars in Ukraine, Libya, Syria, Yugoslavia, even the war in Korea, which killed 20% of their population. He is a freakish war pig who defends CP and watches cartoon bestiality porn. Any quote unquote anti-war rally that advertises Vosh as a speaker is a sick joke.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, I mean, I I would have to agree with that. That's 100% correct. And this is the same fucking thing they do with Israel. They never it's oh, the Netanyahu regime. The you know, Netanyahu. It's never no, like Israel is just fucking evil. Like Netanyahu are not.
SPEAKER_01In their replies, uh Cappy, in the replies to this post, uh Ruth Bader Meinhoff, we have a Red Army faction LARP her, says you literally support the Russian invasion of Ukraine. Holy shit. That old refrain. Okay, well, anyways, you supported Russia.
SPEAKER_02They're not even comparable. None of no nothing. You cannot compare American interventions in imperialism to what is going on in Ukraine. It's fucking absurd.
SPEAKER_01Let's scroll through some of these things. Uh ooh, why the fuck is Vosh in here? Get him out of here. More like NATO left rally. True. The Graham Platner and Vosh. Holy shit, the American Socialist Movement is irredeemable. War criminal and lollicon fanatic. Not sure who is worse. Are you familiar with that thing with Vosh where he did a thing where on his stream he exposed that he had a folder on his desktop that had bestiality andor like little pony kink stuff in there?
SPEAKER_02Yeah, I've seen it. Not only that, but I've seen him on stream defending uh like uh like um child pornography and um and getting rid of the age of consent and stuff. Like he has said some fucking really weird shit in the world.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, he's very weird, like low-key white supremacist, right? Anti-decolonial, anti-land back. He has like audacious fucking positions, just like and he's a progressive.
SPEAKER_02That that word is meaningless now.
SPEAKER_01Mad Crab says booking a pedophile horsecock enjoyer to your neolib sheep herding rally is certainly a choice. True. New Democratic Party sheepdogs have been released. True. Breaking Hassan the uh okay, breaking Hassan is teaming up with Duran CSAM enjoyers, Gunnar of Myers, and known bestiality advocate Vosh to work with the dark money funded organization Progressive Victory, known for doxing creators. True. We read the Liger one. This quote unquote anti-war rally uh that primarily consists of Democrat warmongers, war criminals, pedophiles, and a guy with SS tattoos, and worse of all, the DSA. Uh okay, a spooky, scary socialist says, anybody else remember when okay, anybody else remember when Vosh spent months attacking tankies for being bad optics for the left, and now all he's known for is the lollicon in his in his horse drive? Yep. Yeah. Um do do do do scrolling. Someone uh uh regarding Vosh, someone says, How hard can it be to not invite him lamo? With the picture zoomed in on him, like, yeah, what are they doing? I think ha ha ha ha ha ha ha. Okay, here's this is a good uh encapsulation. Bread tube with CNN liberals and some dirtbag era outliers to call this pathetic and sad would be a huge compliment, true.
SPEAKER_02I I don't get uh like you can't just sweep some of this shit under the rug. I don't get what the the organization was thinking bringing someone like Vosh on. Like you have to know you're gonna get fucking dragged for that shit. Why is Hassan fundraising for democratic candidates? Because Hassan is part of the compatible left. I think it's I think Marxist Leninists who who like him need to face that. That Hassan is a democratic socialist, he's not a Marxist, he's definitely not a quote unquote tanky or anything of the sort, even if he has something nice to say about Cuba every now and again, right? The guy is he's he's he's compromised. He's he's compromised. Like, I don't know, you know. I I think people give him way too big of a benefit of the doubt.
SPEAKER_01Red operative Leninist says anti-war rally, and half these people literally support NATO, more than half.
SPEAKER_02Yeah. Well that's the thing, they'll twist it that NATO is a defensive organization.
SPEAKER_01Uh a sheepdog convention, how nice lol. These fucking quote these quote tweets are pretty funny. Uh okay, that's it. I don't know, uh I don't know. Do you have anything else that you want to add about uh this sheepdog convention?
SPEAKER_02Yeah, fuck these people. Don't listen to these people. If you're if you're a fucking left liberal listening to this podcast right now, don't listen to these people. They're fucking weird freaks and they're lying to you.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, go read um the Jakarta method. Go read um Seriously. Black Shirts and Reds, uh, which I'm currently reading right now. Just go read, just go read. Just go read a little bit about foreign policy a little bit.
SPEAKER_02Alright, uh uh Cappy, uh say goodbye to everybody. Alright, everyone. Don't talk to cops, don't do anything Cappy wouldn't do, and uh have a good uh have a good day.