Episode 010: The Holodomor Lie

The so-called "Holodomor" is the ultimate trump card wielded by liberals whenever communism comes up in conversation. While acknowledging the occurrence of the famine, this article rejects the narrative that it was an act of genocide. Such narratives not only distort historical truths, they also trivialize actual genocides. The evidence suggests that the famine was unintentional and primarily a result of environmental conditions compounded by many other factors.  

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Transcript

SPEAKER_00 0:01

Online Leftists!

SPEAKER_01 0:03

Okay, welcome everybody to another episode of Online Leftists. Now, today is a special episode. So we are cooking up something special for you. A full-on altercation with uh some left deviationist, communist, some ne'er do wells and wreckers online. We're cooking up something special. We're gonna be going into a long form examination of communization theory and its proponents online, some people that have wandered into our comment section. Now we were going to do an episode on them directly, but we went and looked at their profiles, and they were so impotent and so lacking value and disinteresting, there was literally nothing to talk about. And the only thing that makes them significant at all is that they are postpubescent orbiters of an anarchist LARPing as a communist via the theory of communization, which we are going to cover in a long form fashion. Now, to shore up any deficits that me and Cappy may have was such a ridiculous memeable uh theory.

SPEAKER_00 1:07

I have been a Marxist for 11 years, and I did not know what communization theory was until I got on TikTok, which is something I've heard from many people. So not very familiar.

SPEAKER_01 1:17

So it's sort of like uh mega communism, it's just sort of an online meme. Never met one in real life, and because of that, we're having to uh dredge into the depths of left com, uh libertarian communist, and anarcho-communist theory, which it's barely theory. So we're we're covering up these French weird Sino-Soviet split era documents about communization. It's it's a real mess. So uh we were going to do that. We got way laid. Um, so that is upcoming. Now, so which presents us a special opportunity to do a special episode. Now, Red Army Capabaro, do you want to tell us a little bit about where what we're going to be talking about today?

SPEAKER_00 2:05

Yeah. Uh so uh today we're gonna be talking about the so-called Holodomor or the famine of 1932 to 1933. And the reason why we decided to go with this topic was because, quite frankly, uh, I think uh me and all of the mods on my live streams are fucking sick of everyone under the sun bringing it up from uh, you know, leftoids, uh so-called communists, right wingers. You cannot escape Ma Holodomor. So we gotta talk about it.

SPEAKER_01 2:33

Yes, it's a perennial, it's an evergreen topic. Okay, and I see that you have quite the lengthy screed here. So today uh we're gonna be doing something a little bit different, and we're gonna be listening to the dulcet tones and sonorous voice of one Red Army Capabera as he reads this prepared text for you with minor interjections and commentary from me.

SPEAKER_00 2:53

You ready to hit it? I'm I'm ready, I'm ready. I've been ready, I was born ready.

SPEAKER_01 2:56

Well, with no further ado, let's get into the Holodomor lie by Red Army Capabera.

SPEAKER_00 3:02

Thank you, Chloe. Uh, yeah, so I'll I'll just begin. Um, I don't think I need to tell anyone listening what the Holodomor is, but I think that you all know that it is the ultimate Trump card wielded by liberals and everyone under the sun, right wingers, um so-called communists, anyone who doesn't like Stalin essentially will bring this up. Um do you not say what the Holodomor is in this? I don't have to. It's the it's the famine of 1932.

SPEAKER_01 3:27

It's the famine of 1932. It is basically the the mythos is that there was a purposeful starvation of Ukrainian. Well, get into that. And and or and or it was the sort of it was some some of the evils of forced collectivization by evil Marxist Leninists, which led to the privation of food and starvation of people in the Ukraine, right?

SPEAKER_00 3:53

Yes, very yes, that's it. Okay. Get into it. Okay. Uh the so-called Holodomor is the ultimate Trump card wielded by liberals whenever communism comes up in a conversation. While acknowledging the occurrence of the famine, this article rejects the narrative that it was an act of genocide. Such narratives not only distort the historical truths and trivialize actual genocides, but the evidence suggests that the famine was unintentional and primarily a result of environmental conditions compounded by many other factors.

SPEAKER_01 4:23

It was also it was also the last in a line of a series of cyclical famines, if I'm not wrong. Yes. If I'm not mistaken.

SPEAKER_00 4:29

Yes, I I do I do cover that, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 4:32

Okay. All right. Well, go ahead. I'm sorry. I didn't read it.

SPEAKER_00 4:35

You're good. You're good. Um so the the most prevalent narrative surrounding the famine of 1932 suggests that it was a deliberate act orchestrated by Stalin and the Communist Party. This narrative, perpetuated by anti-communist experts and Ukrainian nationalists, suggests that the famine was orchestrated to suppress Ukrainian nationalism and peasant resistance to collectivization. Despite the declassification of the Russian archives and new discoveries in modern research, such narratives have continued to proliferate over the years. In this discussion, we will draw upon a variety of sources to uncover the true events of 1932 and dismantle the falsehoods and misrepresentations surrounding the event.

SPEAKER_01 5:14

Honestly, anything that you would have done to suppress Ukrainian statehood, I'd be for if you gotta serve some people, I'm all right with that personally.

SPEAKER_00 5:21

But with what's going on there today. Yeah. But uh You saved us a lot of trouble. So to learn about the origins of the famine genocide lie, I recommend the book Fraud, Famine, and Fascism by Douglas Toddle. This book reveals that in the early 1930s, the myth was heavily propagated by Nazi propagandist Joseph Goebbels and American capitalists like William Randolph Hearst. Um, for instance, during the September 1935 annual Congress of the Nazi Party, Joseph Goebbels delivered a speech in which he repeatedly asserted that millions were starving and suffering in the USSR due to Bolshevism. Toddl highlights in this book that even the photos of famine victims used by Hearst's newspapers and Ukrainian nationalist groups were not authentic photos from the 1932 famine, but rather from World War I and the famines in the 1920s. We we don't have the time to cover it all here, but it's it's worth reading. Toddl's book is a bit old and and um it's off in a few areas, but it's a valuable resource of information and has continued to be validated in many respects by modern research.

SPEAKER_01 6:25

I for one can't believe that Western media would stoop to such low levels of bad journalism, such as to paint the USSR as evil.

SPEAKER_00 6:33

I know, I know, right? Yeah, especially William Randolph Hearst, right? He's one of the most trustworthy individuals I've ever uh, you know, I've ever heard. Um with how you pronounce his name? Dumb name. Yes. Um It's a stupid fucking name. Where's the R? Yeah, yeah. Now the the uh Ukrainian nationalist narrative alleging that the famine was intentionally orchestrated against the Ukrainian population as a form of ethnic cleansing and genocide is not only false, but it's entirely absurd. For instance, it's widely acknowledged that the famine also affected the northern Caucasus, the southern Urals, Siberia, the Volga region, Kazakhstan, and historian Mark Togger has said that the famine affected virtually the whole USSR, so not just Ukraine. Uh furthermore, as concluded in Mark Togger's critique of papers by Natalia Nomenko, the Soviet policies of the time did not support this alleged anti-Ukrainian bias. Rather, they indicate the opposite.

SPEAKER_01 7:33

Yeah, I think I remember this from the stream. It's basically like they received a greater than average allotment of grain or something.

SPEAKER_00 7:39

Yeah, the uh 1932 procurement was scaled back and free trade was fully authorized. Uh Ukrainian grain procurements were reduced three times more after the national reductions in May of 1932, and in 1933 the government returned 5.7 million tons of grain to the countryside. Additionally, the notion that the famine was a tool of class warfare is just completely unfounded. It lacks any substantiation from the available evidence. It's also claimed that the primary cause of the famine was the grain procurements, which is 100% reductionist. It overlooks the complexity of factors involved, and Togger highlights that although grain procurements exacerbated the famine in some areas, they cannot be deemed the primary cause. Furthermore, Togger notes that although the Soviets did not completely stop grain exports, they did attempt to fight the famine with reductions and aid. Even if the Soviets had completely stopped grain exports, it would not have been sufficient to avert the famine. Yeah. If you view Togger's work, he investigates the various forms of human action as well, from peasant resistance to policy. However, he finds in every case that these aspects could not and did not play a primary role in creating the famine, even considering some of these factors to be caused or exacerbated by the environmental factors.

SPEAKER_01 8:58

Were some of those factors a gigantic spoon uh wielded by Joseph Stalin or Koba?

SPEAKER_00 9:04

Yeah, actually, uh no, nothing like that. In fact, the the the human action that exacerbated the famine oftentimes had to do with like um the management of collective farms, right? And it had to do with um Kulak's sabotage, even. Uh, but uh you know, Stalin did not, and we'll we'll get into this further, but Stalin did not have uh grain hoarded and at his disposal that could have you know readily stopped the famine from happening. That's it's a myth.

SPEAKER_01 9:33

So he did not have like a reconstituted Romanov type throne uh mate festooned with grain that he sat upon as he like looked down upon the Ukrainian people.

SPEAKER_00 9:43

Yeah, just eating their porridge and spitting in their face. No, he didn't have that. Justified in doing so, by the way. Yeah, yeah. Uh though we'll be discussing it more in depth below. I know that some people will accuse me of cherry-picking Togger. Uh while they haven't even read the research themselves. To this, I quote Togger who stated very clearly in Retrospective for Yale Agrarian Studies 2014. Quote, my research challenges the widely held and publicized interpretation of the 1933 famine as man-made as a man-made famine that the Soviet regime allegedly imposed on Ukraine and other regions like Kazakhstan, to suppress political opposition, or for other reasons. My work shows that these arguments usually misuse evidence, avoid contrary evidence, and misrepresent or ignore alternative interpretations. This paper, based on my first paper for the Yale Agrarian Studies series, documented the environmental factors that reduced the 1932 harvest, especially the 1932 rust infestation, and argued that these factors were more important than labor, lack of draft forces, or other factors in causing the crop failure and the famine. Previous historical studies never mention most of the environmental factors I discussed, which were based on Soviet, European, and American scientific studies and data.

SPEAKER_01 11:02

So you got West Oids Cook in the books. Now what what does this mean, draft forces? Does this mean just sort of like uh volunteer or recruited labor to uh what does that mean?

SPEAKER_00 11:13

I always thought that the dra Oh draft for yeah, I I it I believe it is that it could be, you know, sometimes they call the the animals draft animals, right? Oh, okay. Now that this won't be confused, in the following sections we'll delve deeper into the historical context and the multifaceted causes of the 1932 famine, and we'll begin with Which don't it which don't include spoons. Go ahead. No, no spoons, but we'll we'll start with the historical context. Famines have plagued Russia for centuries, and this was predating the tragic events of 1932. Historical records such as the Nikonian Chronicle, volume two, from the year of 1132 to 1240, and the Chronicle of Novgorod from 1016 to 1471 document numerous famines in the years of 1127, 1175, 1181, 1192, 1194, 1214, 1215, 1230, 1251, 1421, and 1445. And we should also add to that the great European famine of 1315 to 1317, uh, which also affected parts of Russia.

SPEAKER_01 12:18

Now, if you're listening to this, I just want to let you know that this is fastidiously and assiduously uh hyperlinked. Each one of those names, each one of those dates that he uh Mr. Red Army Capabera here, Mr. Bearer, if you will, just read off, have a link. This is all like there's just like 12 links right here in this one paragraph uh paragraph. This should be available in the show notes. Yeah. So this article as read will be available in the show notes with all the hyperlinks and everything there. This is a real treat for you guys.

SPEAKER_00 12:51

Yeah, I went through that those links lead you directly to the pages in the particular book with the information on it. Yeah, it was good with it. So um some of the most devastating famines were the Russian famine of 1601 to 1603 and the Russian famine of 1891 to 1892. The former claimed approximately 30% of the population, while the latter affected between 14 to 20 million people, causing 400,000 deaths. The famine of 1899 was so bad that it nearly depleted Red Cross aid. So cyclical famines occurred once every eight to eleven years.

SPEAKER_01 13:27

It's first of all, that's a catastrophic loss of life. Absolutely. That is an unbelievable number. Number one, number two, it's weird to think that the Red Cross was around in 1899. And it's funny, is it in the the Critique of the Gotha program? Uh didn't Marx also shit on the Red uh the what's the other one? Was it the Red Cross? The Salvation Army. Oh, he might have, I don't remember. I think he actually, I'm like, wait, the fucking Salvation Army was around in 1850 and it was a deplorable organization back then. Remember they just recently had the thing where they were like firing trans people or something, the Salvation Army? I was like, damn. The Red Ar the fucking Salvation Army have been shitty for 200 years.

SPEAKER_00 14:12

That's wild. I can't believe they're that old. So in the early 20th century, famines ravaged numerous governance with 49 affected between 1901 to 1902, um, nineteen to twenty-nine of them affected between nineteen oh five to nineteen oh eight, and approximately sixty of them affected between nineteen eleven to nineteen twelve. Governance are like provinces? Yeah, I believe so, yes. Okay. And then the um the upheavals in the late nineteen tens, including the Russian Revolution and the the Civil War, caused agricultural output to plummet. So I think most people know the nineteen twenties witnessed a very grim wave of famines and health epidemics across the country, caused by the chaos of the period as well as environmental factors too. So um it is it's no doubt that the troubles of the 1920s also had an effect on the 1930s, which is a a thing I think people don't consider.

SPEAKER_01 15:10

Um I didn't I didn't know there was mass famines across Russia in the 1920s, Captain. I I don't know, you might be surprised to learn I'm a little bit of a historical idiot. I don't know what the fuck was going on anywhere. I I could barely tell what was going on in uh America during the 1920s, other than, I don't know, Dust Bowl? Question mark?

SPEAKER_00 15:27

I have no idea. Yeah. Um it's that's where uh the pictures that William Randolph Hearst used in his newspapers came from. Came from the famines in World War I. They weren't even of the 1932 famine. So um so historian Mark Togger's work, Natural Disaster and Human Actions in the Soviet Famine of 1931 through 1933, says that over 150 famines occurred in Russia's 1,000 years of recorded history. And while the Bolsheviks inherited this legacy upon seizing state power, they managed to break this cycle, with one exception resulting from World War II and a drought. Um, following the events of 1931 through 1933, the Soviet Union did not experience another famine.

SPEAKER_01 16:08

They had a hunger for feeling failure because all they got was W's.

SPEAKER_00 16:12

Is that right, Captain? Absolutely, 100%. We always get W's. Communists are we we always get Ws. In in the the work that I cited above by Togger, there's a part called Global Context, which points out that the troubles faced by Russia were by no means unique for the time. Uh Togger explains that in 1931 through 1932, the US experienced the Great Southern Drought. China had major floods, French colonies in West Africa experienced infestations, drought, and severe famine. Um, and I feel that all that global context is necessary to kind of cut through the mystification of the event. Um and in fact, I would go a step further than Togger really quick by pointing out that currently in the global capitalist system, around 9 million people die a year from hunger. In the USA in 2022 alone, over 20,000 people died from malnutrition. However, when it comes to hunger and crisis in capitalist society, people easily overlook the devastating facts. With this stated, the next question is what actually caused the famine of 1932?

SPEAKER_01 17:14

It's kind of interesting that in everywhere else there's like starvation, and in the US people have malnutrition.

SPEAKER_00 17:21

That's part of the propaganda, is is is softening the language, as we know. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 17:26

So uh the famine Cappy, what caused the famine of 1932?

SPEAKER_00 17:31

Yeah, I I I'm sure that listeners are gonna love this because they've heard this spiel a million times. Environmental conditions was the primary cause of the drought, which was really what created the famine. The famine of 1932 was the result of a complex interplay of multiple factors, with the primary cause, according to Togger, being the low harvest in 1932, which was caused primarily from drought. However, it wasn't just drought, but a series of extreme natural disasters that played a role. In his extensive analysis, natural disasters and human actions in the Soviet famine of 1931 through 1933, Togger thoroughly dissects the environmental causes and their interconnectedness to other factors, and his conclusions are quite profound. So we'll briefly review the section titled Natural Disasters 1931 through 1932, which begins on page eight of his work. This section highlights that there were several droughts in 1931 and 1932. In 1931, Siberia, the Volga region, Bashkiria, and Ukraine experienced major droughts and hot winds. These conditions persisted through 1932 and were a major cause of the low harvest in 1932. It's notable that Soviet officials did provide aid in attempt to mitigate the effects. They provided seed and food aid and return procurements, utilized drought resistant seeds, among other measures. However, despite these efforts, millions of tons of grain were lost to drought.

SPEAKER_01 18:59

Has ever a young sort of new modality of government face faced such such an uphill battle? They seem beset upon by all sides, by nature, by invading Western forces, by everything. The USSR like really had a tough road to hoe.

SPEAKER_00 19:22

Absolutely. And when you start to understand the history of the USSR, that's what makes you appreciate that they achieved what they did because it's it's beyond fathomable.

SPEAKER_01 19:34

I mean, you've just listed like it's like drought, it was raining, cats and dogs. There was a fire tornado. It's like, wait, what? It's like, holy shit. Yeah. It's fucking it's like insane. Because I think that maybe as softer than baby shit Americans, we sort of take this for granted, especially if you're not from like Hurricane Alley or in the wherever the fuck tornadoes happen. I don't even know. Are you in that part of the country? I'm not. Hell no. I'm in Jersey. In in California, we have earthquakes sometimes, and like basically sometimes a dish falls off the counter. That's basically it.

SPEAKER_00 20:07

No, I get you. Yeah. I mean, there's been like one tornado in my area that I can remember, and it tore a few trees out. It wasn't strong enough to like take down houses. So we have hills and mountains, you know.

SPEAKER_01 20:18

Uh in that one movie Signs, uh, that was in Pennsylvania, and there was that UFO invasion.

SPEAKER_00 20:23

Yeah.

unknown 20:24

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 20:25

I've seen that movie, yeah. Yeah, yeah. I haven't seen you back yet, but yeah, it yeah, I suppose it is. I don't like being called a Pennsylvanian though, because I'm not. I know what you're what you're inferring.

SPEAKER_01 20:39

Okay, go ahead.

SPEAKER_00 20:40

So uh on the flip side, besides the droughts, uh, numerous regions in the USSR experienced excessive rain and flooding. There was even a hurricane at the same time. And as Togger highlights, excessive rainfall can be just as dangerous as drought. Excessive rain destroyed crops, slowed sowing, and reduced yields. And additionally, there was a warm spell throughout southern regions in 1932, which caused fall sown crops to begin growing prematurely, only to perish when the temperatures had returned to normal. So Togger notes that in Ukraine, twelve percent of all fall sown crops subcumbed this way, with a figure as high as sixty-two percent in another district. These weather conditions also created the ideal environment for pests, diseases, and weeds, all of which contributed to the 1932 famine. Togger emphasizes that one of the most significant plant diseases in 1932 came from various strains of fung of the fungus rust, and rust, as Togger explains, is extremely destructive and a tricky threat. I'll quote him real quick. Although in some cases rust will kill grain plants, rusted grain ordinarily will continue to grow, form ears, and in general appear normal, but the grain heads will not fill, so that the harvest will seem light and consist of small grains or of fewer normal size grains, and disproportionately of husks and other functions.

SPEAKER_01 22:01

So there's it's zombie grain.

SPEAKER_00 22:03

Yeah. No, basically, yeah. Yeah. So, like, in other words, a a seemingly healthy grain yield may be substantially reduced due to the rust infestation. A tagar references a Soviet study demonstrating that a hundred percent infestation of rust could reduce the weight of grain by over sixty percent. So it's I mean it's quite significant. Although rust infestations occurred in 1931, they reached their peak in 1932, and this marked the most severe infestation of rust to occur in Eastern Europe. So these infestations persisted through 1933, and alongside rust there was infestations of smut uh with both fungi collectively destroying nine million tons of grain. What's so funny? You like that? What smut and rust? What's up? What's up with this fucking grain? I know it's it's they they it they got wild names. Um do we have smut?

SPEAKER_01 23:02

Do we have smut infestations here in America?

SPEAKER_00 23:04

I mean, I know we do, but of a different variety. Yeah, yeah. Uh it's so it if it seems like things couldn't be any worse, uh the spread of irgot fungus containing the source of LSD also intensified in 1932. And this fungus could actually lead to hallucinations and gangrene and even death, and it it could kill cattle. So CIA just got very interested.

SPEAKER_01 23:28

It can't be you can't be piquing the CIA's interest like this. Yeah, right. Uh well maybe it was them, who knows? But uh, that's what I'm saying.

SPEAKER_00 23:35

It seems MK Ultra related, I'm not sure. Togger references an OGPU reports detailing mass infestations that cause widespread illness and death. And additionally, there were other less severe infestations of diseases affecting crops. However, it wasn't just plant diseases can uh causing concern, but also various pests, which again is another thing that is all people laugh in my lives when I bring up pests. They're like, Yeah, like what you know, what could pests do?

SPEAKER_01 24:03

Well uh can I just say real quick Yeah uh rust, ergot, and smut, oh my continue.

SPEAKER_00 24:13

So Togger points out that warm and humid weather conditions led to extreme infestations of field moths, locusts, weevils, Hessian flies, among other insects. And the damage inflicted by these pests should never be underestimated. So for instance, one district in Ukraine witnessed the destruction of around 500 hectares of beets by weevils in just three hours. Another striking example is the locust infestation covering 2.2 million hectares of grain in Kazakhstan, with three million hectares affected by meadow moths. So, like, to fully comprehend the gravity of these events, one must read Togger's work. Because there's so much detail in his studies, um, then I would have time to go over here. So I I mean I this is why in my life I'm constantly hounding people. Please read Togger, re-Togger, re-Togger, you know what I mean?

SPEAKER_01 25:06

I what I don't get from this is a sense of scale. For instance, like, oh okay, that sounds significant, but I don't know how unusual all that is. It it definitely sounds good on paper, like, oh shit, okay, sounds like they were literally in ta attacked by critters there, but I don't have a sense of scale for how many that is, but I'll trust him that it's an an unusual amount.

SPEAKER_00 25:28

Yeah, no, it was an extremely unusual amount. And again, for anyone listening, read Togger's work, it's it's pretty incredible. So um the other thing that we have to keep in mind and remember was that this period was a period of intense class struggle with the Kulak class. So the the Bolsheviks primarily attempted to employ methods of persuasion to transition peasants over to collective farming. And indeed these methods were successful with many poor and middle peasants. Uh, however, the rich peasants resisted collectivization and employed various tactics to oppose measures introduced by the Bolsheviks, which disadvantaged them but favored the poor peasants. Uh it seems that w I can't believe I wrote that in here. I'm sorry.

SPEAKER_01 26:15

It seems that one of the straws that broke the kulak's back came in the came in the early 1930s when village Soviets were replaced by new Soviets elected only by the poor pleasant uh poor peasants. So the the the Well hold on here. So okay, I don't know shit about the fucking Kulaks. All I know is the Kulaks were saboteurs, bitter grape saboteurs who were killing livestock and burning grain out of fucking uh out of being uh mad at uh impending attacks by giant spoons or something. I don't know.

SPEAKER_00 26:52

So cool Kulaks were the rich peasants. Yeah, they were a class of peasants. They were richer than all of the rest, and they owned a lot of the farms and the biggest farms, and in fact, they would employ the poor and middle peasants on their farms. So they they and they quite literally were like you know they're a part of the capitalist class.

SPEAKER_01 27:10

Yeah, they're m a petite bourgeois.

SPEAKER_00 27:13

Yeah, yeah. You could get yeah, the uh the upper the upper level of that, yes. That the It's interesting.

SPEAKER_01 27:18

What I was reading some one of the principal Marxist texts over the last couple days, and and uh I read like five books over two days. That's for a different podcast, don't worry, or a different episode. But um in it they said like it's I think it was oh that speech he did about wage price and labor or whatever whatever it is, the the one that encapsulates capital, and where he was talking about wages in America. It's very interesting. We have a different idea about what serfdom. Yes, right? But in in that he says, or uh basically that you they the workforce is artificially restrained uh to keep them at wage laborers instead of independent peasants. And I thought, like, wait, is that a step up? But we think of peasantry as like something less than a wage worker, right? But in fact, it's uh better if it's like kind of like middle class almost.

SPEAKER_00 28:14

Yeah. Well, that's why I think you see a lot of people get confused about the kulaks because they're like, wait, they were peasants, so they were exploited. And it's like, I mean, they were peasants that owned farms and employed the labor of peasants underneath them, right? So it's kind of like almost like a dual type thing, you know what I mean?

SPEAKER_01 28:32

So peasantry didn't have to do with income and had to do with relation to a vassal nobility?

SPEAKER_00 28:39

Well, so after the revolution, at least, peasants were just the agricultural class. That's just the name, right? Because you're not the industrial proletariat. Uh they, you know, often they like because the proletariat does not own where they work, but peasants own the land that they till, right? So that's the difference. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 28:58

Oh, okay. So that they would have constituted like the voting class in America, like landowners.

SPEAKER_00 29:05

Yeah, essentially, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 29:07

Oh, that's interesting. Okay.

SPEAKER_00 29:09

So um what this is a fact that's often overlooked, by the way, is that the the kulaks unleashed terror throughout the countryside. I mean, we're talking murdering Soviet officials, burning grain, slaughtering their livestock. Um, Frederick Schumann put the number of slaughtered livestock as follows. Quote, their opposition took the initial form of slaughtering their cattle and horses in preference to having them collectivized. The result was a grievous blow to Soviet agriculture, for most of the cattle and horses were owned by the Kulaks. Between 1928 and 1933, the number of horses in the USSR declined from almost thirty million to less than fifteen million, of horned cattle from seventy million, including thirty-one million cows, to thirty eight million, including twenty million cows, of sheep and goats from one hundred and forty-seven million to fifty million, and of hogs from twenty million to twelve million. So the the Soviet rural economy had not even recovered from the staggering loss by nineteen forty-one.

SPEAKER_01 30:15

That is a staggering, staggering amount of killed animals.

SPEAKER_00 30:20

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 30:21

You think PETA would say something about this?

SPEAKER_00 30:23

I'm I we should call him right now. Yeah. So uh Douglas Toddle points out in his book, Fraud, Famine, or Fascism, that I referenced earlier, that in some aspects Kulak destruction surpassed that of the Nazis in Oc in occupied Soviet territory. Thirty-two million cattle and ninety-seven million sheep and goats were destroyed by the Kulaks, compared to 17 million and 27 million, respectively, by the Nazis.

SPEAKER_01 30:49

So they're basically tantamount to collaborators, not unlike their modern Ukrainian equivalent.

SPEAKER_00 30:56

I mean, I I 1930s wrecking the Soviet state, the Soviets knew fascism was going to invade them because Hitler said it in the 1920s. Yeah, what what are you doing? You know what I mean? Even if you're not purposely being a collaborator, you're you I don't know.

SPEAKER_01 31:13

So I I would never kill my cow. I would always give my cow over to the people's. That's just how I am on the inside. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 31:20

The people's cow. Absolutely.

SPEAKER_01 31:22

I let everybody get suckle upon the udder of my cows.

SPEAKER_00 31:27

Um so uh of course we have to recognize that some livestock was killed in in order for people to eat, and um additionally, many animals died from eating infested grains and from starvation due to the low harvest. However, uh, we shouldn't overlook the impact of kulak sabotage. Uh, this aspect is highlighted in Toddl's book where he mentions a Ukrainian nationalist named Isaac Mazeppa, who encouraged Kulaks to slaughter livestock and burn their grain. Now, uh the reason why this is important is because people always say that the kulaks were not the, you know, they weren't really a big reason why the famine happened. So it's interesting to see a Ukrainian nationalist who encouraged this literally bragging about the success of the kulak sabotage. Uh, and this is in an article published in 1933 in the 1933 Slavonic Review Volume 12 called Ukraine under Bolshevist Rule. And in this article, he stated, I quote, the forms taken by her resistance have greatly varied. At first there were mass disturbances in the Kolkozy, or else the communist officials and their agents were killed. But later a system of passive resistance was favored, which aimed at the systematic frustration of the Bolshevik plans for the sowing and gathering of harvest. Furthermore, he stated, I quote, the opposition of the Ukrainian population caused the failure of the grain storing plan of 1931 and still more, and still more so that of 1932. The autumn and the spring sowing campaigns both failed. Whole tracts were left unsown. In addition, when the crop was being gathered last year, it happened that in many areas, especially in the south, 20, 40, and even 50% was left in the fields and was either not collected at all or was ruined in the threshing.

SPEAKER_01 33:15

I think this guy may have been Azov Battalion. They probably know who he is.

SPEAKER_00 33:21

Yeah, no, I'm sure they love this guy. So uh by leaving crops in the fields, these so-called passive resistors were wasting crops and inviting hordes of rats and other rodents to infest farms. So for instance, Togger says that by January 1933, mice infested 38 million hectares in the North Caucasus alone. So one can only imagine what it must have looked like elsewhere. And additionally, warm weather conditions and rain led to widespread weed infestations on many farms, which is another thing people laugh at when I say, oh, weed infestations. They're like, you mean weeds? Like that? And it's like, yeah, that was. So, I mean, it's it was quite a big deal, you know what I mean. I think there was way more hostile kulaks than that. I've never met a passive kulak. That's why I think it's funny that they call them quote unquote passive resistors.

SPEAKER_01 34:40

Yeah, like honestly, when I see a Kulak walking on the street with my dog, I'm afraid my dog's about to get slain. You know what I mean? I don't know. Hell yeah, I know. So especially if they figure out I'm a Bolshevik.

SPEAKER_00 34:52

Oh, you know what I mean? They might kill me um toast. Yeah. So the the rest of the passage on uh this page from Martin's goes on to state that according to Soviet historians, in the period from January to March 15, 1930, the Kulaks organized in the whole country, excluding Ukraine, 1,667 armed demonstrations, accompanied by the murder of party and Soviet officials and Kolkos activists, and um by the destruction of Kolkosi and collective farmers. In the Salsk Ogrug, I'm not Russian. Oh, you nailed it. Yeah, I think it's something like that.

SPEAKER_01 35:32

I'm actually fluent in whatever language that is, and you actually just nailed it. Good, good.

SPEAKER_00 35:36

So I could yeah, because I was gonna just say in the North Caucasus, um, riots took place for one week in February 1930, Soviet and party buildings were burnt down, and collective stores were destroyed. So these people were quite literally raising havoc, you know, across the Soviet Union. They were very dangerous. Um so it's it's evident that Kulak terrorism and resistance played a significant role in the famine. And as I said, this should not be understated. These were essentially civil war conditions. The Kulaks carried out direct and indirect attacks, sabotaged farms, refused to work, speculated on the market, hoarded grain, killed livestock, etc. So to suggest that this only played a minor role is to me absurd. Um so the interaction Historical revisionism. I mean, right? I mean you you heard it yourself, folks. It was yeah fucking insane. So the interaction of environmental factors and cool terror by themselves caused an unbelievable amount of damage, but this was still not all the factors that caused the famine of the 1930s. What were some of the other causes? Well, in Martin's work, he identifies four main causes of the famine. Two of these causes being the civil war caused by the Kulaks and the droughts in 1930, 1931, and 1932. The third cause was a severe typhoid epidemic that hit the North Caucasus in Ukraine. Martin's evidence is a quote from Dr. Hans Blumenfeld, who said, I quote, There is no doubt that the famine claimed many victims. I have no basis on which to estimate their number. Probably most deaths in 1933 were due to epidemics of typhus, typhoid fever, and dysentery. Waterborne diseases were frequent in Makayevka. I narrowly survived an attack of typhus fever, so he himself even got it.

SPEAKER_01 37:25

It's just like when you think it can't get any worse. Typhus, typhoid fever, and dysentery. I don't know. These are like Oregon Trail diseases. I know. I'm surprised any Soviets made it.

SPEAKER_00 37:36

That's f I replayed that game recently. Awful game. Just straight colonialism. Is is it? Oh, it's settler colonialism. Yeah. That's what it's right. That's what you're it's the Westward expansion.

SPEAKER_01 37:48

Why in the fuck would you replay Oregon Trail?

SPEAKER_00 37:51

I forgot what it was about, and uh it was it was it it it my computer's not good enough to play newer games, so I had to make do with what I had.

SPEAKER_01 38:01

Cappy. You know, I got in trouble one time in class. We used to go down to a computer lab, and there was a bunch of like Apple II computers that had Oregon Trail on them, and I uh I put my name in there as Marijuana, like N-A-R-Y, last name W A N N A. Yeah, and one of the kids told on me because it said like marijuana died of dysentery. You know how it set up like a little gravestone? Yeah. And one of the kids fucking told on me and I got in trouble.

SPEAKER_00 38:34

What a fucking little prick.

SPEAKER_01 38:36

What a little bitch, huh? And I got sent to the fucking, they like sent me out and they like had to have a stern talking to with me. I'm like, and now looking back, it's like I know you thought that was funny. Oh, yeah. Fucking lame ass teacher. I know that was the highlight of your day. This like second grader coming in. Like you said, son, it's not funny to say your name was Marijuana. I was like, you know it is. You were the talk of the teacher's lounge that day.

SPEAKER_00 38:57

A hundred percent. Yeah. So um what continuing on, um, re research by Wheatcroft and Davies corroborates the prevalence of these diseases between 1931 uh to 1933.

SPEAKER_01 39:12

Um but Wheatcroft is a little bit of nominative nominative determinism there. He never had a shot, huh? He was going to be looking into wheat his whole life.

SPEAKER_00 39:23

Yeah, right. It's kind of ironic, yeah. Um I'm sorry, I'm I'm I'm slipping up here. According to Martins. Yeah. According to Martins, the fourth cause of the famine was lack of experience, confusion, insufficient preparation, and reorganization of agriculture. Uh, this transition from uh small individual peasant farming to large-scale collectives understandably faced many challenges.

SPEAKER_01 39:47

Um not only that, Douglas Toddle considers the main cause of the famine to center on the struggle for collectivization, but also considers the drought to be the contributing factor. Though Toddle emphasizes gulag struggle, he also highlights errors within the farm management and party organizations. Cappy, did you know that? Continuing, Toddle quotes an excerpt from the history of the Ukrainian SSR, which reveals numerous factors, such as mistakes by local organizations regarding methods and rates of collect collectivization, distortion of the party line on the middle distortion of the party line on the middle peasantry. Oh, I have questions about that one. And coercion and lack of cadres. This was compounded by capitalist encirclement and class struggle against the This got mad political. Wait, what the fuck? The party line of the middle peasantry, coercion, lack of cadres. What does collective have to do about this? I wasn't even thinking about that's funny as shit. This was compounded by capitalist encirclement and the class struggle against the kulaks of the countryside.

SPEAKER_00 40:52

Holy shit, there's a lot of angles to this thing. Absolutely. I mean, it it's that's why as I was doing this research, I was like, holy shit, like this is not so simple as mean Stalin starved Ukraine. You know what I mean? Yeah. It's like Game of Thrones, but with wheat. Yeah, yeah, right. So uh on the other hand, Togger does d doesn't discount class struggle and cool acotage as factors, but he's skeptical that this was a primary cause, uh, considering this view to be reductionist. Uh Togger says on page six of Natural Disaster and Human Actions in the Soviet famine of 1931 through 1933, I quote Quote, I show that I show that the environmental context of these famines deserves much greater emphasis than it has previously received.

SPEAKER_01 41:39

Environmental disasters reduced the Soviet grain harvest in 1932 substantially and have to be considered among the primary causes of the famine. I argue that capital and labor difficulties were significant but not as important as these environmental factors, and were in part a result of them. I also demonstrate that the Soviet leadership did not fully understand the crisis and out of ignorance acted inconsistently in response to it. I conclude that it is thus inaccurate to describe the Soviet famine of 32 through 33 as simply an artificial or man-made famine, or otherwise to reduce it to a single cause, end quote.

SPEAKER_00 42:13

Yeah, and how could you? I mean, look at all these causes we've gone through. It's it's fucked up. Many causes. It's fucking it's m multicausal. Yeah. So um in light of these analyses, claims by anti-communist, you know, experts uh that the unquote, yeah, yeah, that the Soviet authorities didn't attempt to provide relief or aid contradict substantial evidence. Um Togger states that the Bolsheviks acted inconsistently, which may very well be the case looking back at the event now. However, in the 1930s, it was a very tumultuous period with many issues domestically and internationally. Um when we judge the government's response, we must keep that stuff in mind.

SPEAKER_01 42:53

I always keep everything I can in mind about the Soviet Union in general. Yeah, yeah, you have to. I have to. Otherwise, you know, uh you know, some big uh some other pithy response.

SPEAKER_00 43:05

So as mentioned earlier, Togger's research indicates that in 1932, Stalin ordered four procurement reductions for Ukraine. Uh Ukrainian procurements were substantially less um than other areas because they were actually being prioritized. Um on May 6, 1932, the Bolsheviks reduced grain quotas in every grain producing region, with Ukraine experiencing the highest reduction at 18%. Subsequently, in August of 1932, Ukraine requested and was granted another reduction, this time by over 12%. By October of the same year, the quota was further reduced by one point one million tons, doubling the previous reduction. The fourth reduction came in January of nineteen thirty three and was also for three other regions. Togger's research seems very fair. Seems very fair to me. I'll tell you, if they're trying to genocide Ukrainians, they're doing a bad job. Terrible job. So Togger's research. Research also reveals that the Soviets sent massive amounts of food and seed aid across the country. In February of 1932, 870,000 tons of food and seed aid was sent out to regions in Central Russia and the East. Additionally, in May of 1932, 106,000 tons of grain was sent to Ukraine as food aid. And even industrial workers were sent to rural areas to improve labor organization and productivity, and experts tried to make disease-resistant seeds. In the 1932 harvest and the famine of 1933, Togger states While the leadership did not stop exports, they did try to alleviate the famine.

SPEAKER_01 44:37

A 25 February 1933 Central Committee decree allotted seed loans of 320,000 tons to Ukraine and 240,000 tons to the northern Caucasus. Seed loans were also made to the Lower Volga and may have been to other regions as well. Kolchitsky cites Ukrainian Party archives showing that the total aid to the Ukraine by April 1933 actually exceeded 560,000 tons, including more than 80,000 tons of food. Aid to Ukraine alone was 60% greater than the amount exported during the same period. Total aid to famine regions was more than double exports for the first half of 1933. A significant part of the procurements went to feed other people in Ukraine, in cities and industries, so they were extracted from val uh villages but not from Ukraine. Substantial uh substantial amounts of grain were returned to villages for food and seed. In natural disaster and human actions in the Soviet famine of 1931 through 1933, Togger made the point that the amount of grain exported during the peak of the famine in the first half of 1933, however, approximately 220,000 tons, was small, less than 1% of the lowest harvest estimate. And the regime was using virtually all the rest of the available harvest to feed people. And regarding assertions that Stalin hoarded vast amounts of grain that could have completely prevented the famine, Togger, Wheatcroft, and Davies said, We have not obtained access to the Pulit Bureau working papers in Presidential Archive, to the files of the Committee on Reserves, or to the relevant files in military archives. But we have found enough information to be confident that this very high figure for grain stocks is wrong and that Stalin did not have under his control huge amounts of grain which could easily have been used to eliminate the famine.

SPEAKER_00 46:42

So in conclusion, these findings contradict the claims propagated by anti-communist experts. The evidence suggests that there was not a particularly anti-Ukrainian bias to the aid provided. The Bolsheviks didn't just let the famine happen, but they did all they possibly could as the situation unfolded and as they became aware of it. However, we still have to focus on another aspect of this claim. It isn't just the claim that Stalin took no action to alleviate suffering, rather, it's asserted that he knowingly and willingly allowed tens of millions of people, particularly Ukrainians, to die. Estimates regarding the scale of the famine vary widely, ranging from 7 million to 14 million, with some estimates even exceeding these figures. However, the majority of figures from scholarly research and modern reports does not exceed 10 million. In fact, most barely exceed 5 million. But the pivotal question arises: are these numbers correct? Did tens of millions of people die?

SPEAKER_01 47:38

The number games is a chapter in Toddle's book Fraud, Famine, and Fascism, where he offers valuable insights into various estimated death tolls. Many of the estimates regarding the famine have issues in methodology. While a comprehensive understanding of this topic requires a deeper dive into Toddle's chapter, Red Army Capobera will talk about it a little.

SPEAKER_00 47:58

So Toddle criticizes Dana Dalrymple's work, published in Soviet Studies in January 1964. Dalrymple's methodology lacked scientific validity, relying on averages from 20 Western journalists, some whom fabricated evidence. The highest estimate from Dalrymple's sources was 10 million, but they later cited a source claiming 15 million.

SPEAKER_01 48:22

I know right off the top, that's way too high.

SPEAKER_00 48:26

I won't dive any deeper into Dalrymple. The reader can do this at their own discretion by clicking the hyperlink above. However, I would like to go over other experts who toddled debunks in the next chapter to show why using demographics to estimate can sometimes lead to incorrect conclusions.

SPEAKER_01 48:43

I've never dove into a Dalrymple in my life. Me neither. Never. Never even once. Walter Dusch Dushnick? Dushnick? Dushnik, I think, yeah. Walter Dushnick and James Mace.

SPEAKER_00 48:56

So Walter Dushnick, aside from his Nazi connections, employed a flawed methodology and concluded that over seven million Ukrainians alone died from the famine. On page 69, Toddl described the method as follows. Dushnick's method consists of projecting an anticipated population growth rate based on the 1926 census onto the listed population of the 1939 census for Ukraine. The difference between the hypothetical estimate and the 1939 census listing is then pronounced to be famine victims. And to just add this in there, this is something that uh demographers did with the famine in China as well. Um But Toddle also refers to American sociologist Albert Zamansky. Shout out Zamansky. If you haven't read Samansky, you gotta read Samansky. Um Gotta read him. Yeah, who wrote the incredible book Human Rights in the Soviet Union. On page two hundred twenty-five of this work, Samansky criticized this method as follows.

SPEAKER_01 49:56

Quote The estimate assumes A, that even in conditions of extreme famine, instability, and virtual civil war, peasants could conceive and give birth at the same rate as in less precarious periods. Two, that abortion or infanticide, intentional or not, did significantly increase, and three, that there were as many women of maximum reproductive age in 1932 through 33 as before or after. All of these assumptions are erroneous.

SPEAKER_00 50:23

And Samansky and Toddle both quote historian Stephen Wheecroft.

SPEAKER_01 50:28

As is well known, the first World War, Civil War, and early years of the 1920s caused a great gap in births in these years. The age cohort born in 1914 would have been 16 in 1930, and so would have just been entering the period of major repro reproduction. Consequently, Lorimer and other scholars have concluded that the age structure of the population would have led to a decline in births throughout the 1930s and until the missing populations born into the 1914 through 1922 age cohorts had passed well into the future.

SPEAKER_00 51:01

James Mace, who utilized a similar method, was criticized for equating population deficits with excess morality without considering a decline in birth rate and other factors. In other words, he tried to figure out how many people might have died by looking at how many babies were expected to be born and comparing it to the actual number of people recorded later. He came to a similar conclusion as Dushnik at around 7.9 million deaths. So another important example illustrating the pitfalls of such methods is the nationality swap of uh Kuban Cossacks from Ukrainian to Russian.

SPEAKER_01 51:36

On page 72 of Todd's book, he says But in a rather unusual oversight for Harvard expert on Ukrainian history, Mace fails to take into account a significant event which occurred between the 1932 and 1933 famine and the 1959 Soviet census, World War II. Mace seemingly hadn't heard that Ukraine was preoccupied by Nazis from 1941 through 1944 and was the scene of battles which took the lives of millions of combatants and civilians alike.

SPEAKER_00 52:07

It's interesting, isn't it? And while we're it is while we're at it, it's worth addressing anti-communist figures like Robert Conquest, whose work funded by British intelligence has greatly shaped uh people's perceptions of Soviet history.

SPEAKER_01 52:21

So, what's up with this Robert Conquest guy?

SPEAKER_00 52:23

Yeah, so uh Robert Conquest wrote the book The Harvest of Sorrow, and in it, Conquest estimated that there were 8 million deaths from the famine and 6.5 million as a consequence of deculakization, uh, making a total of 14.5 million deaths. However, historians such as Wheatcroft dispute these claims uh in a collaborative work called Stalinist Terror New Perspectives. That's a book by like I think J. Arch Getty, uh Wheatcroft, a whole bunch of the more honest uh bourgeois historians. But good title. Good title. That's definitely libs libs might be confused and pick that up. Yeah, oh yeah, yeah. I mean the the book is, you know, it's not pro-communist or pro-Stalin by any means, but there are some facts in it that are honest and we can't just reject. So Wheatcroft put the number of excess deaths at four to five million. And Conquest is criticized a number of times in other essays for numerous errors outside of this one as well. Uh so you know, maybe we shouldn't trust British intelligence agents. Uh but with that said, the number was not fourteen million, ten million, or seven million. So how many was it, right? Um, and it's impossible to know for sure, however, we'll have a look at some of the more sensible and modern estimates. Uh realistic estimates and modern research. Um as uh as we already established, Wheatcroft estimated four to five million in demographic consequences of the Great Uh Famine Then and Now by uh France Mesley, uh Jacksville, and I hate these fucking French names, dude. And Yevgan Evgeny uh you want me to by France Mesley, Jak Valen, and Evgeny Andrive. Yes, thank you. They estimated somewhere between 2.6 to 3.5 million deaths resulting from quote crisis-related excess mortality, end quote. Um Ukrainian historian Stanislav Kolchevsky estimated around 3.9 million deaths from hunger. And if you click uh Stanislav's name and review the article there, uh it doesn't translate well with Google to warn you. He mentions two other historians named Voldemir Kubayovich and Kubigovich. Yeah. How would you say the next one? Vasil Vasil Kirchhoff. Yeah. Uh guys, we're we're Americans, remember. So yeah, the important thing is that the former estimated 2.5 million and the latter estimated 4.8 million, according to Stanislav. So these two were pre-declassification of archives. Uh Stanislav landed in the middle of these estimates in 2002 with modern archival evidence. And it's um it's worth noting that while Douglas Toddle was criticized for his claim of two million deaths in fraud, famine, and fascism, most estimates from that era were in a similar range. However, these estimates began to inflate in the 1950s following World War II, especially after the death toll of six million Jewish people in the Holocaust was calculated. While Toddle's estimate may not have been entirely accurate, it is still much closer to many modern day estimates than the absurd numbers we've seen thrown around in the past. You don't have to search far on Google to find incomprehensible numbers. So as I stated, there is no definitive estimate on the matter. Uh, and while there was undoubtedly much suffering and mortality, the ranges provided above are substantially lower than what was commonly asserted.

SPEAKER_01 55:53

I see. I kind of tuned out a little bit. So you were sort of questioning the historical narrative about deaths in the Holocaust? No, no.

SPEAKER_00 56:00

So this is an example of this is uh actually a great example to give of the double genocide theory because it was right, that's exactly what they were trying to do. They wanted to make it out so that the quote unquote Holodomor was worse than the Holocaust. They tried to uh market, yeah. They tried to market the Holodomor as a Holocaust against Ukrainians. A lot, yeah. No, it's definitely, yeah. Um gross fucking these people probably also would allege that the you know Holodomor was worse than the Holocaust.

SPEAKER_01 56:30

Yeah, no, they definitely so there's definitely a political mechanism, a political rhetorical mechanism at play, and sort of they're incentivized to vastly overinflate this to sort of drown out the real-world atrocities that were done by the Nazis with the aid of financial direct investment by westoids.

SPEAKER_00 56:53

Yeah, and and and and Nazi collaborating countries have put a lot of time and effort into trying to make the Soviets look worse. Uh because they're trying to hire the USA and Canada. Yeah, and over there in the in the Balkans and Poland and stuff like that. It's it's actually fairly popular because they can downplay their own their own crimes during the time. And in conclusion, the famine of 1932 was not an intentional starvation of Ukrainians or a tool of class struggle. It had no anti-Ukrainian bias, and it can't be reduced to forced collectivization policies, a favorite fabrication of anti-communists. The fact of the matter is that the famine of 1932 was primarily caused by environmental conditions that intersected with a multitude of human actions from poor management of collective farms to Kulak sabotage. The tragedy has been leveraged by Western academics and liberals as a means of making the USSR look more evil than Nazi Germany. The research about this is riddled with more smut than the Ukrainian wheat was. Maybe it's the season for Western academics to be forcefully collectivized. Winky face.

SPEAKER_01 57:56

Winky face, yes. It's riddled with smut. It is a lot of fucking smut. And rust. Rust. And don't even get me started about the air god. Oh god. Yeah. Fuck I've won a fucking episode. But uh this is Cappy. This is some of the most prolific and seductive media that I have seen regarding uh demystifying and def uh defabricating the narratives about the horrors of uh for starvation by Joseph Stalin and or Giant Spoons.

SPEAKER_00 58:31

Yeah, and can you believe I was uh the reason why I never published this was because I was self-conscious about it.

SPEAKER_01 58:39

How do you why?

SPEAKER_00 58:40

I don't know. You thought that it's contentious? No, I just made it and I was like, I could do I could write this better. It's fine.

SPEAKER_01 58:48

You know what I mean? It just sort of yeah, yeah. You're good. Yeah, I see what you're saying. There's some like uh there's some issues with some of the pull quotes and stuff like that. But for being after seeing that gigantic array of uh weed paraphernalia that you have, I'm surprised it's this coherent. Yeah, and I tell you what, in a pinch, I think it's made for a delightful episode. Awesome, yeah. I had fun. Yeah, so uh okay, so thank you guys for listening to this. Uh, we are uh preparing uh this is sort of like an impromptu episode here. Uh we're doing this in a pinch, and we are setting about to do a two to three episode series coming up here, a run that should lead to the force collectivization and or gulogging of all left comms and communizers on TikTok. We're just gonna fucking we're gonna we're gonna lock them up and throw away the keys. Oh yeah. Lock them up. Change their login passwords, you're never gonna see them again. It's gonna be delightful. Yeah. Uh change their face IDs and whatnot. Don't worry about it, it'll never they'll never bother you again. Uh the these these uh a specter is haunting the TikTok live streams and it's fucking leftcoms for real lurking everywhere.

SPEAKER_00 1:00:03

Yeah, fuck them.

SPEAKER_01 1:00:04

Anyways, uh okay, that's it. Kathy, is there anything else you want to tell these people?

SPEAKER_00 1:00:07

No, you know. Uh don't trust Kulaks, uh, don't talk to cops, don't talk to leftcoms, um, and um, yeah, you know, have a good uh have a good day. Uh avoid smuddy wheat. Yeah, yeah.